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Google changes its messaging strategy again: Goodbye to Allo, double down on RCS

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Re: Google changes its messaging strategy again: Goodbye to Allo, double down on RCS

#181

Post by donbox »

jayd16 wrote: post #177
moksha256 wrote: post #134

Didn't Google have messaging figured out with Google Talk? Everyone was on Gmail all day (as many still are) and people actually used it. Then they let it wither, came out with Hangouts, and it's been a downhill train wreck from there. Google Talk had the potential of being one of the biggest messengers in the world...they own Gmail and Android (!!!!!). Are you kidding me? There's really no good reason for them NOT t…

It's a pretty simple explanation. Google talk was XMPP which is just not a good mobile protocol.

Could not they just replace the XMPP protocol with whatever better protocol, while keeping the GTalk alive.

Re: Google changes its messaging strategy again: Goodbye to Allo, double down on RCS

#182

Post by s0rce »

nmcfarl wrote: post #122
scrooched_moose wrote: post #110

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> unreliable Really? It's the only messaging format that works without a data connection and is an absolute godsend when I'm out camping, rural biking, or at large sporting events and the towers are absolutely swamped. I'm in a situation at least once a month where the only reliable communication method is SMS.

Wow - infrastructure varies. Here in Eastern Oregon the pattern is pretty reliably that data and signal drop out at the same time, at least on Verizon which is the carrier with the best coverage. I really thought the pattern that you describe, which I've seen plenty of in the past, had just died out over time and tower upgrades.

Same with Eastern WA and CA, you basically just drop behind a big hill/mountain or into a valley and lose all service. I still sometimes use texts since I can turn off data to save power and still send SMS.

Re: Google changes its messaging strategy again: Goodbye to Allo, double down on RCS

#183

Post by seabrookmx »

stephenr wrote: post #83
seabrookmx wrote: post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To be fair, the migration from Talk to Hangouts was pretty smooth, and Hangouts still works. Google gave up pushing Hangouts for consumers but I don't think it's going anywhere, as it's a big part of G-suite for corporate customers. Though with Slack and Discord I'm sure it's usage isn't as strong as it once was.

> the migration from Talk to Hangouts was pretty smooth I take it you never used google talk via xmpp.

I did actually. They kept the XMPP compat running for quite a while after, so for me Pidgin and my old blackberry GTalk app kept working.

Eventually they shut it down though, but in an uncharacteristic move they gave quite a bit of lead time.

Re: Google changes its messaging strategy again: Goodbye to Allo, double down on RCS

#184

Post by arkadiytehgraet »

azinman2 wrote: post #142
jimktrains2 wrote: post #100

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Quite frankly the core problem with Google's strategy is involving then at all. Instead, go the manufacturers and campaign against supporting sms at all. It's insecure, slow, unreliable, monitored, among many other things. Push the manufacturers to an open Android messaging api that runs over TLS (or double ratchet) and bypasses the carriers completely, but the manufacturers can still rebrand. But it's universal. I…

iMessage is end-to-end encryption.

How do you know that? Have you seen sources and verified that those sources are actually compiled and shipped with the final product?

Re: Google changes its messaging strategy again: Goodbye to Allo, double down on RCS

#185

Post by rm999 »

moksha256 wrote: post #134

Didn't Google have messaging figured out with Google Talk? Everyone was on Gmail all day (as many still are) and people actually used it. Then they let it wither, came out with Hangouts, and it's been a downhill train wreck from there. Google Talk had the potential of being one of the biggest messengers in the world...they own Gmail and Android (!!!!!). Are you kidding me? There's really no good reason for them NOT t…

Google dominated non-SMS chat in the late 2000s/early 2010s. I don't think they realized how insanely valuable that was - they were basically sitting on the future of communication. All they had to do was sit back and let network effects build their monopoly (with some more tech build-out and straightforward marketing in international markets).

Instead, they myopically saw Facebook as a threat and started one of the most user-hostile rampages I've been victim to. They hobbled existing products and over-complicated new products to force people onto a platform no one asked for. Facebook (and others) used this opportunity to grab communication away from Google.

It's all an interesting business case study of missing the forest for the trees.

Re: Google changes its messaging strategy again: Goodbye to Allo, double down on RCS

#186

Post by djrogers »

exabrial wrote: post #87

The carriers are idiots. It's where innovation goes to die. We had to pull them kicking and screaming into the smart phone and data era. (Remember When AT&T sent a paper copy of every image you downloaded on your iPhone in a bill?) Quite frankly the core problem with Google's strategy is involving then at all. Instead, go the manufacturers and campaign against supporting sms at all . It's insecure, slow, unreliable,…

> Remember When AT&T sent a paper copy of every image you downloaded on your iPhone in a bill?

No, no I don't - that has to be apocryphal.

Re: Google changes its messaging strategy again: Goodbye to Allo, double down on RCS

#187

Post by discreditable »

andybak wrote: post #53
eigenvector wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Re. being able to switch carriers and still communicate, what happens when you travel and (temporarily) get a local SIM? Are you suddenly messaging all your existing contacts from an unrecognized foreign number "Hi, it's John, this is my temporary Thai number..." and then relying on that message not getting binned by some spam algorithm? What prevents carriers from charging extra for RCS messages originating abroad?

> what happens when you travel and (temporarily) get a local SIM? The real fix would be sensible roaming charges so you don't need to.

That would seem to be less likely than getting every carrier to implement RCS.

Re: Google changes its messaging strategy again: Goodbye to Allo, double down on RCS

#188

Post by apeace »

> WhatsApp benefitted from being a first mover — all the other early leaders in Western markets are nowhere to be seen today

Has Signal ever released numbers on active users? My anecdata on this is that ALL of my friends use Signal--and not because I use it or because as their tech-savvy friend I told them they should use it. I just started seeing them show up in Signal over the last year.

I get the feeling that Signal may have a massive user base nobody really knows about, because they don't publish these numbers. Anybody know?

Re: Google changes its messaging strategy again: Goodbye to Allo, double down on RCS

#189

Post by bingobob »

baybal2 wrote: post #39
TaylorAlexander wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It’s funny because they squashed open standards when they were the big player and then push for open standards when they’ve lost market share. I wish companies believed in open standards for the value they bring to society, rather than selectively supporting them based on competitive interests.

I think there is a pattern with Google: Social network: Orkut was their one and only working social network. Google - it is not great, so we raze it to the ground and make a better product... and they were trying to do so for last 12 years. Messenger: Talk was their one and only working messenger. Google - it is not great, so we raze it to the ground and make a better product... and they were trying to do so for last…

sometimes question are ask is web code old, insecurity? does it scale? power profile, can we support it?

look at flash was massive but it was insecure and had to be replaced.

from my understanding talk had to be change due to mobile network usage and battery drain.

sometime it isn't black and white what kills a app and most of these products are free so it isn't like google owes you anything.

i think they could communicate this better with people be more open on why a product is put to rest or replaced

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