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Google permanently bans popular application from Play for not using IAP

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Re: Google permanently bans popular application from Play for not using IAP

#171

Post by almata »

damiongrimfield wrote: post #145
napoleoncomplex wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I can assume what challenges Google is facing based on how successful other companies in the space are in providing the same service, namely Microsoft and Apple. Google: 32 countries Apple: 90 countries (probably more now, info from 2012) Microsoft: 127 countries Yes, Microsoft and Apple had a head start, but the difference is just way too big, and Google hasn't moved that number in a year and a half. I don't want Go…

> Google: 32 countries Where did you get this info? I'm not doubting you; I just find it crazy that they have offices in over 40 countries[1], but only allow app submissions from developers in 32 countries. [1]: http://www.google.com/about/company/facts/locations

Sligthly related to the part you find crazy, Google has their main European HQ in Ireland, basically because of the very low corporate taxes here, but guess what? It's impossible to buy a Nexus on Google Play from Ireland. If you try you get this message:

-- Sorry! Devices on Google Play is not available in your country yet. We're working to bring devices to more countries as quickly as possible. Please check back again soon. --

They say they're working on it. But that's just a lie. This message has been there for at least the last two years (probably a lot more) and nothing has changed. And we're not talking about a small country in the middle of nowhere. Ireland is part of the the European Union. And they not only have offices here but their main European HQ. They just don't care at all.

Re: Google permanently bans popular application from Play for not using IAP

#172

Post by netcan »

napoleoncomplex wrote: post #12

I know Google's policy on this, but I completely understand where the developer is coming from. Google has been taking a collective shit on every developer out of its list of seller countries[0], which is ridiculously short and hasn't been expanded in god knows how long, and even then, there were only a handful of countries added. On Google's page about seller countries they say: "We're working hard to add more count…

It's interesting seeing Google as a grown up company, with many of the flaws they acquired early on still intact and at Google scale. You can be spending $100ks per monthon adwords and still not have a competent person to call when you need help. EVen if you do, they don't know much and can't do much. Realistically, it's not much better than an outsourced call centre and much worse than the far less profitable Big Ads platform.

When the Nexus 4 went live, they didn't have anywhere near the stock needed to match demand. If you now want to buy a current nexus phone or tablet, you have to be in a country where they allow purchase. They would deliver a much better customer experience (and sell many more phones) if they just let Amazon handle selling them. They even redirect you away to a sorry page and don't let you see the product page. It all feels very non-native to the internet experience and oddly insulting.

Google Wave, Hangouts, Play store (webapps, chrome apps, plugins & android apps) all have bad branding/clarity problems. People just don't understand what these things are, even when they really try. WTF is a hangout? Why does it want to have my SMSs go through it. What is a chrome app? I've heard salespeople in gadget shops assure buyers that any app on their android phone will also be available for their Chromebook. Google don't know how to create the necessary nouns and verbs people can use to understand what these things are. They have a serious tendency towards zombocoms.

This is just one more example.

Re: Google permanently bans popular application from Play for not using IAP

#173

Post by iSnow »

rmrfrmrf wrote: post #84
13hours wrote: post #73

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Each one of those ton of things have been solved by Apple, Samsung and BlackBerry in many of the countries Google doesn't support. They can copy what any one of these 3 did if they really wanted to help developers.

Can they? What if the process is patented?

Obviously PayPal, which is way smaller than Google, was able to pay to this developer.

Re: Google permanently bans popular application from Play for not using IAP

#174

Post by chilldream »

rmrfrmrf wrote: post #90
NotOscarWilde wrote: post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I'm not even a Google fanboy, but what do you know about the challenges that Google might be facing? It's a really strong accusation to say that a company is not working hard just because you can't have exactly what you want. This argument works only because companies like Google prefer no communication with their user/developer base. If they took the time and posted a short note explaining which challenges Google…

It's a lose-lose situation for Google to do such a thing. They're not making an argument; they're making policy. I'm under the impression that the policy isn't up for discussion, in which case it's wise for Google not to pay people to reiterate what we already know.

The point is, if a company wants the public to forgive them for terrible outcomes, they should have to give the public the evidence that they deserve forgiveness instead of having random people shill for everything they do on spec. It is possible for corporations to make mistakes, or to do bad things, and it's perfectly legitimate to call them out when that appears to be the case.

(I also think Google has long past squandered any right to the benefit of the doubt, but I don't see the need to get into that right now)

Re: Google permanently bans popular application from Play for not using IAP

#175

Post by downandout »

yohui wrote: post #117
downandout wrote: post #91

Earlier quoted context omitted.

An expansion may never come. When they created their new policy requiring use of Google Play for all IAP, they could have easily carved out an exception for app teams not based in countries served by their payment system. Anyone bright enough to be hired by Google to write app store policies would have been smart enough to anticipate this scenario. Since Google doesn't make glaring mistakes like this, it was intentio…

> The only logical conclusion is that Google wants all Android development outside of the countries it has named to cease immediately. What would be the motive? More likely they didn't want to risk carving an exception (leading to e.g. scammers taking advantage of the loophole, breaking users' payment expectations, etc.) . Restricting third-party payment methods within a curated store is related to but distinct from…

I have no idea what the motive would be. But I do know that without financial incentive, it is difficult to believe that Android development will continue outside of Wallet-supported countries. They could still use in-app banners, but those revenues tend to be abysmally low vs. IAP and in many cases will destroy the user experience. There may be a few people that code them for pleasure or practice in these countries, but if there is no money in it, people will find better things to do.

Re: Google permanently bans popular application from Play for not using IAP

#176

Post by freehunter »

jamespo wrote: post #108
rmrfrmrf wrote: post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Do you think that's good for users though? Especially with Google's lax oversight of the marketplace? If the developer using their own payment method changed their PayPal redirect to a phishing site, would users notice? What if you implemented your own credit card payment? Where's the guarantee that you're PCI compliant? I can tell you that 99% of your users won't know what PCI compliance is. If Google allows users t…

On that basis maybe Google should stop Chrome allowing credit card form submissions.

But instead of doing that, they now offer to remember your credit card numbers in the browser. That's a big no thank you from me.

Re: Google permanently bans popular application from Play for not using IAP

#177

Post by downandout »

This makes a strong case for simply never submitting apps to Google Play. It's easy enough to release them directly and explain to users how to disable Android's default security restrictions. If an app is of sufficient reputation and quality, this won't be a major stumbling block to obtaining installs.

Re: Google permanently bans popular application from Play for not using IAP

#179

Post by iancarroll »

alextingle wrote: post #161
iancarroll wrote: post #136

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In the suspension notice I received I had a way to appeal it.

Did it work? In my experience, I fixed the problem they reported, but then they still refused to reinstate the site. I was left playing 20 questions, trying to guess which other policy I might have violated.

I didn't bother - it would've taken me over a year to reach the payout threshold.

Re: Google permanently bans popular application from Play for not using IAP

#180

Post by RKearney »

spacemanmatt wrote: post #94
beaumartinez wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Android is more open than iOS. You're conflating Android with the Google Play Store. With Android, you can install apps from more than one store.

You are always free to publish your own Android app from your website, implement any and every payment method you like, and get filthy rich from it. You don't have to give Google 30%. That's only if you want to get marketed on their app store. Compare to Apple, where there is no choice but sell through the app store. Side-loading is cryptographically prevented. App store or nothing. I'd say Android is more open.

>Compare to Apple, where there is no choice but sell through the app store. Side-loading is cryptographically prevented. App store or nothing.

Sigh…

This is just simply not true. Using a Corporate Developer account ($300/yr) you can create applications to distribute amongst users of your origination without the need to list the application in the app store.

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