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US Ends Support For Ukrainian F-16s

ukrainetoday.org

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Re: US Ends Support For Ukrainian F-16s

#171

Post by cjes »

deadbabe wrote: post #163
throwaind29k wrote: post #146

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is no one in Europe not skeptical of the increase in defense spending? Things have costs, that money is having to come from somewhere. Is increasing traditional military spending the way to go in the 21st century? If the decision is left to military leaders,they might spend massive amounts of money preparing to fight yesterday's war. If you set aside alarmist positions, it may very well possible that Russia has no in…

Europe has benefited a lot from not having to pour tons of money into defense spending. Europeans will be hurting if their countries suddenly have to shift finances for this. I think it’s much easier to just hunker down and appease the United States for four years and hope the next administrations are more merciful.

"hope"

Re: US Ends Support For Ukrainian F-16s

#172

Post by bad_haircut72 »

sovietmudkipz wrote: post #121
postingawayonhn wrote: post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

NATO as has existed is already over. Nobody has any faith that the US will follow through on its Article 5 obligations.

If that’s the case that “NATO as has existed is already over” then maybe it is wise for the USA to pull out. Maybe that’s the endgame for Europe? Europe defends Europe (or gets taken over by Russia I guess), and USA isn’t on the hook for its defense anymore.

Americans all have this attitude that theyre "on the hook" for everyone elses defence as if theyre the white knight defending the world against evil. Its more like the local mob tough guys who have been taking protection money for the last 40 years backed down when a rival gang finally decided to make a move

Re: US Ends Support For Ukrainian F-16s

#173

Post by tesch1 »

sovietmudkipz wrote: post #39

I genuinely wish there was an understandable endgame for the USA. The USA seems to be throwing its weight around but I’m not entirely sure to what end. This headline/article is just one area where the US is behaving perplexingly. I understand that Trump wants Zelenskyy to sign the minerals deal and that implicitly there’s security guarantees. Fine there’s at least a through line. However; by demonstrating that the US…

> point was to spend their 2% GDP on American armaments

Do the NATO agreements specify American armaments? Europe could have spent on European armaments and armies too, just chose not too because they didn't see a reason to.

Europe not buying F35 or whatever hurts US arms industry, but probably not the general strategic position of the US. There's even a credible argument (dont know how credible?) that these arms programs actually undermine security by investing crazy money in outdated / ineffective technology. The dumb part would be not learning from the Ukrainians how to fight a modern war.

US participation in NATO may be made redundant, but Europe's need for a credible collective defense agreement is not going away.

Re: US Ends Support For Ukrainian F-16s

#174

Post by ryao »

What stops the Russians from reprogramming their radars to switch to a different frequency every 5 minutes as specified by a CSPRNG? It seems like it would make the manual reprogramming of jammers pointless.

Re: US Ends Support For Ukrainian F-16s

#175

Post by mrweasel »

So in the article, they talk about the AN/ALQ-131 jammer. It needs to be updated by the US, to keep up with the Russia counter measures, that's what's stopping. At least the F-16 donated by Denmark will most likely have pylons from Terma (ECIPS), which should work with the CJS from Leonardo (ECIPS/CJS).

Shouldn't be to hard for Europe to make the required pylons for the planes who don't have the ECIPS and for those that do, some of them might already have CJS installed.

It's a problem for sure, but it's a manageable one.

Re: US Ends Support For Ukrainian F-16s

#176

Post by jfengel »

tim333 wrote: post #129
postingawayonhn wrote: post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

NATO as has existed is already over. Nobody has any faith that the US will follow through on its Article 5 obligations.

I'd say it's on hold for four years till they get a new president. In the meanwhile I guess the other members will have to try to manage.

But what about four years after that? It's just not a good idea to depend on someone who is aligned with your enemies, even intermittently.

Re: US Ends Support For Ukrainian F-16s

#178

Post by simion314 »

fellow_eng_25 wrote: post #53
azalemeth wrote: post #38

Trump is really a disgusting human being. I'm not a US citizen but this looks an awful lot like treason -- he is actively helping an enemy of the state.

[flagged]

Explain USA vote in UN, they voted with Ruzzia and other despicable dictators. Not even China voted with Ruzzia and obtained.

But you can explain how the genius Trump placing USA in this group of countries is actually good for USA.

Re: US Ends Support For Ukrainian F-16s

#179

Post by Sammi »

sorokod wrote: post #158

The Danish air force is likely experiencing a buyers remorse about their batch of F35s. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Royal_Danish_Air_Force

"27 in total ordered; 17 delivered as of January 2025; 11 in Denmark and 6 in Luke Air Force Base for training purposes as of January 2025"

Project is so far along that Denmark is probably stuck with them.

Re: US Ends Support For Ukrainian F-16s

#180

Post by jfengel »

sovietmudkipz wrote: post #121
postingawayonhn wrote: post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

NATO as has existed is already over. Nobody has any faith that the US will follow through on its Article 5 obligations.

If that’s the case that “NATO as has existed is already over” then maybe it is wise for the USA to pull out. Maybe that’s the endgame for Europe? Europe defends Europe (or gets taken over by Russia I guess), and USA isn’t on the hook for its defense anymore.

America is pulling out. That is the only reason that NATO is ending.
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