Working for MSP's a large companies demanding 24/7 on-call with computers waking you, even after managers explicitily stating they expect 70 hour weeks.
It is time.
Major union launches campaign to organize video game and tech workers
171–180 of 513 posts
Re: Major union launches campaign to organize video game and tech workers
#172Here is a direct example of unions slowing down the little guy in the entertainment industry: https://youtu.be/LRVwlif6th0?t=171 Niko has to cut costs to make low budget films and the union mandates someone watch the camera feed for the director, completely unnecessarily in the modern era. The film industry is notorious for the boundaries around union and non-union work. Gary Oldman's decline of a role in Star Wars u…
I generally agree. What we do need is better worker protections and consumer protections. Get rid of no-competes. Get rid of right to work statutes. Add mandatory retirement contributions. Add mandatory and standard severance packages.
The best outcome is the industry self-regulating these amendments into their business practices under the threat of unionizing, rather than actually turning the industry into an institution itself and losing it's creative spark.
Re: Major union launches campaign to organize video game and tech workers
#173Earlier quoted context omitted.
> What do you actually have to lose? In some parts of the US, the answer is "Our industry". There are areas where a reasonable argument can be made that overweening unions played a key role in setting up the local economy for cataclysmic failure. Detroit is an example. That said , video games production doesn't look like that right now. It's just perhaps worth considering that people's fears might not be wholly merit…
But again. This doesn't hold up to a straight forward comparison to many European countries. If labour costs would be so detrimental to employment we'd still be queuing to the transatlantic ocean liners.
We could always compare unemployment rates in the US to those in France for a straight forward comparison to a European country. Then we could compare full-time employment rates for another straight forward comparison to a European country.
The American experience is that labor can and occasionally has set itself up for massive failure in the past. The idea that there's literally nothing to lose fails a basic sanity check against not-so-distant American history.
It may be worth considering the possibility that some people might might legitimately, earnestly, and honestly perceive there to be real risks. A pitch to such people of "You have nothing to lose!" runs the risk of coming across as, optimistically, ignorant. Perhaps such things could be worth considering for a person as informed and thoughtful as yourself?
Re: Major union launches campaign to organize video game and tech workers
#174Earlier quoted context omitted.
No. Not if you understand how unions work. Professional sports leagues have unions because they are necessary. There is exactly 1 league, and you’re required to sign exclusivity contracts with your team. You are owned by your team. You play for them, or you don’t play at all. You move your family to whatever shitty city bought your rights. Only rarely does a player get any say, unless they’re a superstar with a speci…
> There are many reasons for players to have unions, and none of them apply to software developers. There are analogs to some of the things you listed. For example, exclusivity contracts sounds a lot like non-compete agreements. You play for them, or you don't play at all sound like employment agreements where the employer demands rights to everything you create during your time of employment. You move your family to…
They're analogs in only the most surface way though. There's no "Computer Science Draft" where companies get to pick you and lock you into a contract that you must accept no matter which company it is.
Sure, things like non-competes and inventions clauses are restrictive, but not even within the ballpark of the restrictions on most sports contracts. Most leagues make it literally impossible for you to "change jobs" to a different team AT ALL for years at a time, while at the same time reserving the right for them to transfer you to any other job they want.
Sure, Google or whoever might try to transfer you to a different office, but you have the option to quit and try to find another job in the same city. Most athletes, if they're being traded from LA to Boston can either A. Move as commanded or B. Retire completely forever unless they move to another country. Being forced to quit and find a new job in the same industry sucks, but it's better than forced retirement...
Re: Major union launches campaign to organize video game and tech workers
#175As a tech worker (game industry or not), what should I expect when/if I join a union? A 3-minute googling only gave me very vague answers like higher salary and better workplace safety. Is there a potential pro and con somewhere? e.g. If I get better compensation, would the union take a percentage cut from it? Or it's a fixed union deduction?
It entirely depends on the structure of the union so you’d want to look at specific examples.
Re: Major union launches campaign to organize video game and tech workers
#176Here is a direct example of unions slowing down the little guy in the entertainment industry: https://youtu.be/LRVwlif6th0?t=171 Niko has to cut costs to make low budget films and the union mandates someone watch the camera feed for the director, completely unnecessarily in the modern era. The film industry is notorious for the boundaries around union and non-union work. Gary Oldman's decline of a role in Star Wars u…
We live at the absolute _extreme_ of capital power over labor power. Unions can certainly do harm, and you are right that they shouldn't be seen as a pure and irreproachable force for good, but small anecdotes about individual bad decisions made by unions are not useful in discussions about this.
In fact, they play to the already ridiculously anti-union sentiment that the vast majority of Americans (this article is about America, apologies if you are foreign) hold.
Unions can go way too far, and they can do harm, but the overwhelming majority of Americans live so far away from that point that it's not even a fruitful discussion to be having.
Re: Major union launches campaign to organize video game and tech workers
#177Earlier quoted context omitted.
But again. This doesn't hold up to a straight forward comparison to many European countries. If labour costs would be so detrimental to employment we'd still be queuing to the transatlantic ocean liners.
We could always compare unemployment rates in the US to those in France for a straight forward comparison to a European country. Then we could compare full-time employment rates for another straight forward comparison to a European country. The American experience is that labor can and occasionally has set itself up for massive failure in the past. The idea that there's literally nothing to lose fails a basic sanity…
> We could always compare unemployment rates in the US to those in France for a straight forward comparison to a European country. Then we could compare full-time employment rates for another straight forward comparison to a European country.
Sure, go a head. Historically as well. Furthermore, what kinds of jobs are those actually? What is the quality of the jobs? Do they enable a dignified existence and so on?
> The American experience is that labor can and occasionally has set itself up for massive failure in the past. The idea that there's literally nothing to lose fails a basic sanity check against not-so-distant American history.
Do you have an example where it was obviously due to unions?
Re: Major union launches campaign to organize video game and tech workers
#178Here is a direct example of unions slowing down the little guy in the entertainment industry: https://youtu.be/LRVwlif6th0?t=171 Niko has to cut costs to make low budget films and the union mandates someone watch the camera feed for the director, completely unnecessarily in the modern era. The film industry is notorious for the boundaries around union and non-union work. Gary Oldman's decline of a role in Star Wars u…
We live at the absolute _extreme_ of capital power over labor power. Unions can certainly do harm, and you are right that they shouldn't be seen as a pure and irreproachable force for good, but small anecdotes about individual bad decisions made by unions are not useful in discussions about this. In fact, they play to the already ridiculously anti-union sentiment that the vast majority of Americans (this article is a…
> We live at the absolute _extreme_ of capital power over labor power.
No we don't, that is called slavery.
Re: Major union launches campaign to organize video game and tech workers
#179How Americans can be so anti-union by default is really beyond me when looking at the facts at the ground: * A culture of overwork (especially in the game industry). * No vacation. * No parental leave. * No sick leave. * At-will-employment (which inherently causes massive under-reporting of things like sexual harassment in the workplace due to the fear of losing ones livelihood, and please spare me the "actually it's…
The facts on the ground is most people don't deal with that in their job. We don't have a culture of overwork, we get vacation, parental leave and sick leave. There are exceptions, but those are entry level no skill required jobs.
Sexual harassment is treated firmly in every company I've been in - even entry level jobs. There is no fear of retaliation for reporting it. (generally it is impossible to prove so the reporting doesn't go anywhere)
Re: Major union launches campaign to organize video game and tech workers
#180Earlier quoted context omitted.
> creating more opportunities for young new grads to break in Just going to point out, everywhere, I have ever heard of a union it generally made it harder for new people to come in, not easier, by increasing the commitment an employer is expected to make to an employee, and by making it harder to remove employees that need to be removed but can't because of their seniority with the union.
There's definitely a tension. When employers can treat employees as disposable, there is more firing and thus (sometimes) more hiring. However, unions increase the value of jobs. Union workers enjoy a better QOL and career stability, and they can actually build a life for themselves without worrying about being fired on a whimsy. Luckily for something like game development, it is a growing industry with a low barrier…
Game dev is not a low barrier to entry industry. It is WAY easier to get a SDE job at a FAANG straight out of college than it is to get a job as a programmer at a big name studio, even with experience.