Earlier quoted context omitted.
Can’t it be opt-in?
> Additionally, as part of a future software update, users will have the ability to choose to participate in grading
That could mean opt-out.
Apple suspends Siri response grading in response to privacy concerns
171–180 of 227 posts
Re: Apple suspends Siri response grading in response to privacy concerns
#172Earlier quoted context omitted.
I think the outcry is mostly: 1.) Apple literally plastered "What happens on your iPhone stays on your iPhone" ads around CES to make fun of competitors. - https://www.macworld.com/article/3331597/apple-privacy-billb... 2.) Apple always slams competitors over their lack of privacy on every keynote. I think the outcry is more than warranted when the company is blatantly lying to your face in their marketing.
Only that Siri doesn't happen on the iPhone, and it's easy to prove: try using Siri with aeroplane mode on.
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Re: Apple suspends Siri response grading in response to privacy concerns
#173Earlier quoted context omitted.
Microphones connected to power and internet 24/7 have been in people’s houses since the 1990s (or earlier, if you consider the phone network to be equivalent). Yet it only became “creepy” when they started talking back. This tells me it’s an emotional response, not rational.
Cell phones, even now, can't be doing that much background processing unknownst to us, because they are connected to a battery, battery life is a big deal in a highly competitive industry, and we'd all notice if they drained very quickly. ISTR there are documented instances of law enforcement and/or intelligence doing that sort of thing to phones, and the battery drain causing it to get noticed. Hooking it up to an o…
I don’t think battery life is a problem. I think the examples you mention were from much older phones with limited local storage, so they were basically just in a call the whole time, and burning power operating the radio. A modern phone can save the data to local storage and upload it opportunistically.
We know that modern phones fan constantly listen to the microphone with minimal power impact, since that’s what these voice assistants are doing. That’s specialized hardware, but adding a little something to save the data wouldn’t be hard.
Even if we take it as a given that it can’t be done on batter power, phones get connected to outlets pretty regularly. Have you ever heard someone refuse to charge their phone in their house because it’s creepy?
Re: Apple suspends Siri response grading in response to privacy concerns
#174So far, most of the comments here are a good example of both why this happened and why it will happen again. When people complained that putting microphones in your home 24/7 was creepy, the response was "that's nonsense, Siri is not sending anything unless you specifically ask for it". When it turned out that it does send things you didn't intend, the response was "well, it's not like anyone is listening anyway". No…
> We really need mandatory ethics courses in CS.
You think the CS grads / devs are the ones deciding to do this? We're not really given true autonomy. We're grunts. Someone above us decides to do the spying and we either do it or hit the job market.
Re: Apple suspends Siri response grading in response to privacy concerns
#175How about we start treating these sorts of freeform data with the highest security and privacy they deserve? If it might contain HIPAA data, treat it as you would HIPAA data. If it might contain military secrets, treat it as you would under top secret clearance. If it might contain personal data, treat it as you would under GDPR. When it's always on for a huge portion of the population, treat it like it's likely enough to contain data that should be held under a really high standard. Don't treat it under the average case standard.
If your users are usually saying "Hello, i am unhappy I spent two hours on hold" but a few thousand data points say "hello, my name is john doe. I have HIV, I live at 123 Main Street and my social security number is 987654321" treat the whole dataset as the latter case. Maybe we should even pass regulations along those lines.
Re: Apple suspends Siri response grading in response to privacy concerns
#176So far, most of the comments here are a good example of both why this happened and why it will happen again. When people complained that putting microphones in your home 24/7 was creepy, the response was "that's nonsense, Siri is not sending anything unless you specifically ask for it". When it turned out that it does send things you didn't intend, the response was "well, it's not like anyone is listening anyway". No…
> We really need mandatory ethics courses in CS. You think the CS grads / devs are the ones deciding to do this? We're not really given true autonomy. We're grunts. Someone above us decides to do the spying and we either do it or hit the job market.
"I'm just doing my job" - Nazi soldiers operating Holocaust ovens
Re: Apple suspends Siri response grading in response to privacy concerns
#177Earlier quoted context omitted.
You need to carefully read what you are quoting. The microphones are in the houses 24/7, connected to power and the internet. That is creepy. There were also several creepy situations involving these devices: * Google home had a hardware flaw which actually made it record 24/7. * all assistants activate by mistake when they think they recognize the activation word. Siriously. * An Amazon Echo recorded a private conve…
Microphones connected to power and internet 24/7 have been in people’s houses since the 1990s (or earlier, if you consider the phone network to be equivalent). Yet it only became “creepy” when they started talking back. This tells me it’s an emotional response, not rational.
It's totally rational. When the mic activates only when I physically press a button or pick up a device and dial a number, it's different from it activating itself. I'm in control of the former, and am happy to have it in my home.
Re: Apple suspends Siri response grading in response to privacy concerns
#178Earlier quoted context omitted.
Microphones connected to power and internet 24/7 have been in people’s houses since the 1990s (or earlier, if you consider the phone network to be equivalent). Yet it only became “creepy” when they started talking back. This tells me it’s an emotional response, not rational.
It's totally rational. When the mic activates only when I physically press a button or pick up a device and dial a number, it's different from it activating itself. I'm in control of the former, and am happy to have it in my home.
How do you know you’re in control?
Re: Apple suspends Siri response grading in response to privacy concerns
#179Earlier quoted context omitted.
It's totally rational. When the mic activates only when I physically press a button or pick up a device and dial a number, it's different from it activating itself. I'm in control of the former, and am happy to have it in my home.
How do you know you’re in control?
I don't. It's a spectrum.
I don't know that an old-school land line phone isn't always listening. But it was made by some disinterested party who just makes hardware. It was a simple logical device designed to rely on a simple mechanical switch. It could be listening, but it's understandable by someone like me and there's no incentive for anyone involved. I don't really know if I'm in control, but it's reasonable to think I am.
I don't know that a modern voice assistant isn't always listening either. It is an incredibly complex device usually designed by an entity whose business makes hundreds of millions of dollars based off of the inspection of the personal data of people like me. It is a complex full functioning computer. It uses a statistical algorithm that I know will incorrectly activate sometimes. I cannot understand or predict when it will listen. I cannot understand or predict when it will send a recording somewhere. It receives updates frequently. Because it's a full computer with an internet connection, those updates could make it do a huge variety of things. I know I'm not in control.
Re: Apple suspends Siri response grading in response to privacy concerns
#180Earlier quoted context omitted.
> When people complained that putting microphones in your home 24/7 was creepy, the response was "that's nonsense, Siri is not sending anything unless you specifically ask for it". This seems like a distorted representation, to support your argument, of what most the complaints and responses were. The gulf between 24/7 recording and "occasionally unintentional sending" is absolutely massive and you just merge them in…
Many apps turn the microphone on and leave it on. Even if they aren’t recording it all or having somebody listen, it is clearly to spy on you to see what you are doing. (Ie did you hear some ad?) That’s not a conspiracy theory, and it is practically indistinguishable from constant listening for the normal person.
>Many apps turn the microphone on and leave it on.
Source?