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Apple Vision Nope: Why I returned mine

jorgeherskovic.net

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Re: Apple Vision Nope: Why I returned mine

#161

Post by nh2 »

nmstoker wrote: post #48

Why on Earth can people return these for non-fault reasons?! It's the other customers who bear the cost to cover this - like indecisive ditzy clothes shoppers who order huge numbers of items knowing they'll return 90% of them.

When we went to test it in an Apple store a few days ago, Apple staff could not answer product questions such as "does it support WebXR".

The in-person demo of the Vision Pro in the Apple Store is scripted to a few actions and apps that the user is allowed to open under supervision, and nothing else.

E.g. you should not open a website of your choice in Safari.

Apple staff said "we cannot tell you what the device can or cannot do, and we are not allowed to let you try it it out here in the Apple Store; you need to first buy it and try it out at home. If you find it cannot do what you want, you can return it."

With this approach, it makes sense that all returns are accepted.

Re: Apple Vision Nope: Why I returned mine

#162

Post by fsh »

nozzlegear wrote: post #36
ubj wrote: post #11

> When we price out things in the USA we pretend sales tax doesn’t exist, but it does, hoo boy it does, and most of us pay it. The price breakdown in this article was probably the most useful part. There was a slim chance I would have considered a product like this for $3700, but $5000 is simply too much for my budget.

The author's price breakdown matches mine almost identically, and like he said: if it weren't for the 0% financing for 12 months, there's no way I would've swallowed that $5000 pill. I still haven't decided if I'm going to return mine or keep it yet. I find it pretty compelling and I like to write code with it in bed or on the couch, but I can't say it's better than my much cheaper (by comparison) iPad Pro for such t…

I just don't get this obsession with taking on debt. "Financing" doesn't make a product any cheaper. If you can't pay $5000 now, you probably shouldn't buy the product.

Re: Apple Vision Nope: Why I returned mine

#163

Post by SllX »

paxys wrote: post #60

Any product that has to be defended by "this is just V1, wait for it to get more mature before it can be useful" is doomed to fail, and this is the most common line in every Vision Pro review I have read. Every successful Apple product to date has been indispensable from the moment it is first launched. On the other hand if people aren't able to extract value out of a $3500 piece of tech in front of them today then n…

> Every successful Apple product to date has been indispensable from the moment it is first launched.

Counterpoint: the Apple Watch and AirPods were not indispensable from day one but became very successful product lines for Apple over time. I still wouldn’t call them indispensable (generally at least, I consider my AirPods Pro pretty damn indispensable personally though) and they still consistently bring in billions for Apple per quarter.

However I am not optimistic about Apple Vision Pro. It’s Macintosh money with an iPad’s software distribution model. The iPad could never replace the Mac with that model, and I don’t see these being any more ambitious with what is public knowledge at the moment.

Re: Apple Vision Nope: Why I returned mine

#164

Post by password54321 »

PaulHoule wrote: post #158
password54321 wrote: post #83

Earlier quoted context omitted.

People actually spend money on the App Store.

People spend money on apps (mostly games) from the Quest store.

The vision pro is being built on top of an already large and successful ecosystem. The Quest store is literally just for the Quest that has nowhere near as many customers.

Re: Apple Vision Nope: Why I returned mine

#165

Post by neodymiumphish »

pcurve wrote: post #138
SllX wrote: post #37

> The other usefulness problem is visionOS’ iPad heritage. Maybe a completely locked-down computer for $1,000 is OK, but for a geek who likes to tinker, and at this price? It’s too much of a content consumption device at the moment. I love watching a movie or TV show, but I want to do stuff beyond the walled garden. > $5,013 Man does this really cut to the heart of it. It has a Mac chip, it costs as much as a high en…

I agree. Some folks really want this to succeed because we haven't had a breakthrough product for a while and this is beautifully constructed. However, I'm keep reminded of the trash can Mac Pro; it's a totally wrong form factor. If they can make it less bulky, less heavy, similar to even Magic Leap 2, it would have a wider appeal.

The biggest ick for me is the external battery. And you know this is a problem when Apple works so hard to hide it in their marketing material.

You can’t swap the battery without losing power… Insane

Re: Apple Vision Nope: Why I returned mine

#166

Post by codelobe »

> The endgame in a few generations, ignoring physics, is a pair of eyeglasses

Vuzix AV920 is closer to that, and many years earlier...

I've been using VR since Quake and Descent came out in the 1990's. The tech still isn't there yet. I'm not sure why there's any new buzz over this old-n-busted "Now in 3D" tech from 3 decades ago. I prefer the slimmer form factor of Vuzix's (albeit older) offerings -- I simply WILL NOT strap a toaster oven to my face when I know that I don't have to do that just to get 3D imagery in my face.

Disclaimer: I've been developing a 3D GUI that doesn't use glasses.

Re: Apple Vision Nope: Why I returned mine

#167

Post by samatman »

jsheard wrote: post #49
paxys wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> A fast 2TB NVMe drive can be had for ~$130 Not if the drive is soldered to the motherboard..

With thin laptops you can maybe justify that as a necessary compromise for the form factor, but there's no good reason the Mac Studio shouldn't have a hatch on the bottom with two or three M.2 2280 slots inside. You can put your own PCIe SSDs in the Mac Pro, but that's so wildly marked up compared to an equivalently specced Mac Studio that it probably cancels out any savings.

I remain flabbergasted that there's no model of Mac Mini or Studio which has M.2 slots. I believe the Doctrine is that Thunderbolt is fast enough that YAGNI but that's absurd given the amount of open space inside those things. If you look at a picture of the motherboard[0] it's dead obvious that there's room for one M.2, maybe two if they cared about it.

[0]: https://www.ifixit.com/News/57898/mac-studio-teardown

Re: Apple Vision Nope: Why I returned mine

#168

Post by archagon »

fsh wrote: post #162
nozzlegear wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The author's price breakdown matches mine almost identically, and like he said: if it weren't for the 0% financing for 12 months, there's no way I would've swallowed that $5000 pill. I still haven't decided if I'm going to return mine or keep it yet. I find it pretty compelling and I like to write code with it in bed or on the couch, but I can't say it's better than my much cheaper (by comparison) iPad Pro for such t…

I just don't get this obsession with taking on debt. "Financing" doesn't make a product any cheaper. If you can't pay $5000 now, you probably shouldn't buy the product.

You can invest the money in the meantime, leading to anywhere from guaranteed 5% to likely 10-30% returns.

Re: Apple Vision Nope: Why I returned mine

#169

Post by samatman »

AmVess wrote: post #132
causal wrote: post #9

The fact that Apple is still using a difference of 256GB storage to jump the price $200 is really funny to me. This is already a wildly premium device, but they just can't resist trying to scrape a little bit more.

It is absurd that Apple is still charging laughable amounts of money for tiny, inexpensive components. It was somewhat justifiable before when their products were simply better than anything else. Now, everyone else has caught up on quality, and charge vastly less. Even worse, Apple no longer innovates and simply doesn't care about making things that work. For example, I bought an OLED Windows laptop that was nearly…

> Now, everyone else has caught up on quality, and charge vastly less.

This is evidently not true for the Vision widget, which is the topic at hand. The hardware is in a league of its own. I would argue this is also true of the Watch line. I decline to discuss the laptop question, and for phones, sure, if you are ok with paying Apple prices for an Android, you can get one of comparable quality for the same amount of money. Just not for less.

Re: Apple Vision Nope: Why I returned mine

#170

Post by HumblyTossed »

sircastor wrote: post #136
HumblyTossed wrote: post #80

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I genuinely think Apple wanted this to be relatively unpalatable to the typical consumer. Based on what? Apple cultivates this myth that they wait to enter a market until they can produce the best device in the market. So, I disagree, I think Apple thinks this is the best device they could have built right now and it's for everyone with $3500 to drop on it.

There's a point where you can't further your product without getting it into the hands of actual consumers. We saw it with the Apple Watch after the first version it became less a communication device, and more a health and fitness device. I do think Apple thought this was the best device they could make that did this thing, but estimates are that they can make about 800k of these things. I think the price point inte…

> They want early adopters. Mostly they want developers.

Of course.

> I think the price point intentionally pushes it away from the typical consumer.

I disagree. I think they truly believed this thing is worth this much in it's current state and if they built it people would buy it.

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