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Study: Most Dog Breeds Highly Inbred

ucdavis.edu

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Re: Study: Most Dog Breeds Highly Inbred

#161

Post by AlbertCory »

pxc wrote: post #159
AlbertCory wrote: post #119

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Thanks, I expected a flood of condemnations! The term "backyard breeder" is just one step up in snobbery from "trailer trash." I got my two cats from families that could be called backyard breeders. To me, that meant that children played with the kittens, which is especially crucial to cats. So if you want a golden (fantastic dogs, btw!), there are lots of breeders. You might have to drive for a few hours to find one…

> The term "backyard breeder" is just one step up in snobbery from "trailer trash." The term is often used to refer to people running extremely sketchy for-profit operations (basically very small scale puppy mills). Operations like that often falsely present themselves as the more innocent 'oops my grandma's dog and my dog bred one time because we didn't know hers wasn't fixed' type. Traditional breeders have all kin…

> The term is often used to refer to people running extremely sketchy for-profit operations

Yeah, no question. There are also people, like the family I got my first cat from, that like to breed animals and do their best to be kind to them. Perhaps some term that doesn't conflate the two groups would be preferable.

Re: Study: Most Dog Breeds Highly Inbred

#162

Post by AlbertCory »

pxc wrote: post #160
AlbertCory wrote: post #155

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sorry, but you're resorting to word salad here. "The welfare of the dogs placed in it's [sic] care" is not at issue, as I'll demonstrate: Let's say a highly desirable dog, say a beautiful young Golden Retriever, is brought to the shelter, and further, let's suppose the shelter euthanizes all dogs after two weeks. Normally, a member of the public would adopt this dog within a day or less. They're a very popular breed.…

Rescues typically house their dogs in foster homes rather than shared kennels, and are more likely to engage in rehabilitation and training than shelters are. Dogs at breed rescues generally get way more individual attention and care. > the only argument you're left with is "the Rescue group will do a better job of choosing its home." Not proven and doubtful, sorry. Those people are volunteers with no training and no…

As for the foster homes: point taken. Although it's irrelevant if the dog is so desirable that someone adopts it right away. Which is the case we're talking about here after all.

As for your comment about shelters: you're just plain wrong about that. There's a stereotype that they're about as diligent as the DMV. Wrong. Considering the breed rescue people are mostly unpaid volunteers who don't stick with it very long, it's probably a wash.

Re: Study: Most Dog Breeds Highly Inbred

#163

Post by spfzero »

denton-scratch wrote: post #152
Vetch wrote: post #125

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah, from what I've read Collies are a smarter breed and also vary in intelligence amongst themselves. High obedience has been shown to at times be counter to good test performance as it means lower curiosity, higher dependence on humans and lower problem solving persistence. Collies are curious, enjoy learning and having a job but can be chaotic when bored, which is markedly different from incurious obedience. > Th…

> Can you explain the significance of not being a Kennel Club breed? Well, the Kennel Club rates breeds in terms of their conformance to "spec", which is a lot about appearance. Inevitably, breeders breed to the spec. Border Collies aren't bred to any spec. (Collies are a different breed, which I believe is rated by the Kennel Club)

That's also true for English Sheppards; they are bred for temperament, not conformance to appearance rules. So they don't all look identical, but they are great companions (and good at herding).

Re: Study: Most Dog Breeds Highly Inbred

#164

Post by smorgusofborg »

CyberRabbi wrote: post #132
SubiculumCode wrote: post #90

I like mutts. Healthier and more sane.

Not if they are a mix of two inbred breeds. Good genes are what inherently matters not muttiness, which is just a lazy proxy for good genes.

That is not correct as typical remaining genetic problems are not successfully bred out since they are recessive.

The mutt will almost always be healthier than it's parents as it is highly unlikely to have any recessive ailments of either line.

Re: Study: Most Dog Breeds Highly Inbred

#165

Post by topicseed »

krona wrote: post #11

The UK kennel club allows you to calculate the inbreeding coefficient for either a registered (pedigree) dog or for future puppies of two potential mates: https://www.thekennelclub.org.uk/search/inbreeding-co-effici... This kind of information is used by responsible breeders and buyers, thus my dachshund has 0% inbreeding going back 5 generations.

I think some pure breeds, due to their slight inbreeding by design, are going through "inbreeding depression". Probably because some breeds just don't have that large of a gene pool to start with.

[0] https://breedingbusiness.com/inbreeding-depression/

Re: Study: Most Dog Breeds Highly Inbred

#166

Post by pxc »

AlbertCory wrote: post #162
pxc wrote: post #160

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Rescues typically house their dogs in foster homes rather than shared kennels, and are more likely to engage in rehabilitation and training than shelters are. Dogs at breed rescues generally get way more individual attention and care. > the only argument you're left with is "the Rescue group will do a better job of choosing its home." Not proven and doubtful, sorry. Those people are volunteers with no training and no…

As for the foster homes: point taken. Although it's irrelevant if the dog is so desirable that someone adopts it right away. Which is the case we're talking about here after all. As for your comment about shelters: you're just plain wrong about that. There's a stereotype that they're about as diligent as the DMV. Wrong. Considering the breed rescue people are mostly unpaid volunteers who don't stick with it very long…

Fwiw I think what's good about breed rescues, when they are good, are virtues that shelters could also have, in principle (and some shelters do). I would rather rely on robust, publicly funded and publicly accountable shelters that emphasize foster programs of their own than fall back on a ton of random, breed-specific, donor-funded organizations. Seems like that would be better for dogs of mixed and unpopular breeds, as well as more convenient when it comes to locating a dog for adoption.

I wonder whether breed rescues have an easier time finding fosters to volunteer for them than shelters do. I could imagine they might, because of emotional attachments people have to breeds that look like dogs they remember from childhood or that they've had positive experiences with or whatever.

Re: Study: Most Dog Breeds Highly Inbred

#167

Post by odd_perfect_num »

shituonui wrote: post #153
djsbs wrote: post #145

Earlier quoted context omitted.

1.“I don't believe you. It is pretty obvious someone would object to luxury cars and jewelry:” Let me revise, since I have met ppl like OP: Im so bewildered at this attitude that I’ll just ask “what problem do people like you possibly have with luxury cars and jewelry?” 2. Jewlery can be made with slave labor. There is nothing inherent in jewelry that it must be made with slave labor. Thus, you can object to a availa…

I don't really believe that luxury cars or jewelry are inherently evil and won't defend those claims. I gave those as examples of (obvious) reasons people might object to those things. >Clearly some ppl buy expensive things to show off, but I dont think it follows that their intention is to demean. I don't think it matters what the intention is. Our society universally denigrates the poor and elevates wealth to a vir…

It sounds a bit like you're arguing that people can't have nice things because it will make others feel bad?

It's definitely an unfortunate truth that our brains are wired to compare ourselves and our belongings with others. Still, it's kind of nice to have nice things.

Re: Study: Most Dog Breeds Highly Inbred

#169

Post by simplyaccont »

rory wrote: post #109
hairofadog wrote: post #102

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not the person you're replying to, but: I love dogs, I have a dog, and I think dog breeding is a net evil. I wish it would stop. Edit: While it's admittedly over-the-top snarky, this video sums up my feelings nicely: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aCv10_WvGxo

There is an ethical version of breeding that would be good for society though (and I imagine this exists to some extent outside the mainstream mainstream). E.g. if a breeder decides "I want a hypoallergenic dog between 40 and 50 pounds with a calm demeanor who is otherwise maximally healthy" instead of worrying about the the nitpicky specifics of their appearance, that would be a benefit for society. It's more the cu…

you just described proper poodle breeders: hypoallergenic, ~50lbs, bred for good demeanor (part of standard description, i believe) and do extensive genetic testing to exclude problematic lineages.

Re: Study: Most Dog Breeds Highly Inbred

#170

Post by AlbertCory »

pxc wrote: post #166
AlbertCory wrote: post #162

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As for the foster homes: point taken. Although it's irrelevant if the dog is so desirable that someone adopts it right away. Which is the case we're talking about here after all. As for your comment about shelters: you're just plain wrong about that. There's a stereotype that they're about as diligent as the DMV. Wrong. Considering the breed rescue people are mostly unpaid volunteers who don't stick with it very long…

Fwiw I think what's good about breed rescues, when they are good, are virtues that shelters could also have, in principle (and some shelters do). I would rather rely on robust, publicly funded and publicly accountable shelters that emphasize foster programs of their own than fall back on a ton of random, breed-specific, donor-funded organizations. Seems like that would be better for dogs of mixed and unpopular breeds…

Yeah, one can imagine some kind of public-private partnership that combines "love for a specific breed" with "ease and fairness in finding & adopting the dog you want."
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