Running a Law Firm on Linux • Hacker News Board

Re: Running a Law Firm on Linux

#161

Post by gbrown » Fri, Nov 12, 2021, 6:54 PM UTC

hpcjoe wrote: post #85

terminalcommand wrote: post #13

Also a lawyer here, I think the biggest hurdle is MS Word. MS word is the defacto IDE of the law world. We spend most of our time in Word. The drafting of documents won't be a problem with libre office. You can send a PDF to the client. But working with other lawyers/parties could be a challenge. I am not certain how Libreoffice could handle a 500 page memo being worked by 50+ people including thousands of track chan…

Not a lawyer. Zoom client on Linux works and is IMO more reliable (e.g. doesn't BSOD me) than windows, about the same reliability on Mac. Teams is unreliable on every platform (having used it for years on Linux, Mac, Win). Would recommend against it. Clearing documents metadata in Libreoffice, yes. It existed as far back as 7 years ago when I was running my own company, and my lawyers and I would be exchanging docume…

It does keep running and using CPU after exiting though, so I always have to ‘pkill -f zoom’ it.

Re: Running a Law Firm on Linux

#162

Post by colejohnson66 » Fri, Nov 12, 2021, 6:56 PM UTC

earthscienceman wrote: post #127

terminalcommand wrote: post #13

Also a lawyer here, I think the biggest hurdle is MS Word. MS word is the defacto IDE of the law world. We spend most of our time in Word. The drafting of documents won't be a problem with libre office. You can send a PDF to the client. But working with other lawyers/parties could be a challenge. I am not certain how Libreoffice could handle a 500 page memo being worked by 50+ people including thousands of track chan…

As a scientist I'm really tempted to ask: Why not latex and track changes? I already know the answer of course, but it's interesting how much of this type of thing is 'cultural' and institutional momentum.

TeX and any derivatives aren't WYSIWYG. People (non-tech and even some in tech) don't want to write code to generate their document. They want to pull up Word, type some stuff, click the table button or something, and go on their merry way.

If there's an issue on page 45 of the printed document, they know exactly where that is in Word due to it being WYSIWYG. In TeX, it's not that simple.

TeX is extremely powerful. I love it (although it does feel a bit "hacky"), but for the majority of people, it's overkill. Word's change tracker is good enough.

Re: Running a Law Firm on Linux

#163

Post by sandGorgon » Fri, Nov 12, 2021, 6:56 PM UTC

has anyone used Softmaker Office ? https://www.softmaker.com/en/softmaker-office

it is far more Word compliant than Libreoffice. Compatibility with MS Office is its #1 goal. It costs 80$.

I have found it to be far far more better than Libreoffice honestly. I have actually installed it in a backoffice (using Fedora) and nobody has ever had compatibility issues with MS Office till today (the other side does not even realise it)

Re: Running a Law Firm on Linux

#164

Post by brightball » Fri, Nov 12, 2021, 7:02 PM UTC

terminalcommand wrote: post #13

Also a lawyer here, I think the biggest hurdle is MS Word. MS word is the defacto IDE of the law world. We spend most of our time in Word. The drafting of documents won't be a problem with libre office. You can send a PDF to the client. But working with other lawyers/parties could be a challenge. I am not certain how Libreoffice could handle a 500 page memo being worked by 50+ people including thousands of track chan…

Office365 Word in browser?

Re: Running a Law Firm on Linux

#165

Post by Kessler83 » Fri, Nov 12, 2021, 7:02 PM UTC

I've used GNU/Linux in large, Windows/Mac dependent companies for 25 years. You need to convince the IT-department, and you need to survive the first week learning how to connect to whatever system is in place, but after that, it's free of incidents to the point of being boring.

My advice for convincing the IT-department is to pick something that is known to be very secure and stable. I use Debian Stable.

My advice for the first week is to initially use the web interfaces for printers, e-mail etc. Move onto native solutions at your own pace.

When somebody tells you how GNU/Linux isn't good enough, 99 times out of a 100, it is someone who has limited actual hands-on experience, or someone who is a bit insecure and territorial about the Windows/Mac systems that he does know. Ask them how they know, and tell them you will look into the specific issues they mention. Return later and show them what you have found.

Word documents cause problems in Windows/Mac contexts too, constantly, so don't fret if you run into trouble. In addition to Libreoffice, a very quick way to deal with small inconsistencies in layout is to use pandoc with a template word-file. Basically, export a new word-file from your old one, using the template to strip the inconsistencies away.

Aim to learn Bash and regexp, at least to some degree. It can save you a ton of time.

GNU/Linux has fantastic tools for working with pdfs, comparing files of various kinds, quickly find information in a large file system and many other things. They evolve all the time. Make it a habit to check how others handle the same task you handle. Perhaps they have found a new and even better way?

Gradually start using Emacs Org-mode. There is nothing that compares.

Re: Running a Law Firm on Linux

#166

Post by tjalfi » Fri, Nov 12, 2021, 7:12 PM UTC

wonderwonder wrote: post #29

terminalcommand wrote: post #13

Also a lawyer here, I think the biggest hurdle is MS Word. MS word is the defacto IDE of the law world. We spend most of our time in Word. The drafting of documents won't be a problem with libre office. You can send a PDF to the client. But working with other lawyers/parties could be a challenge. I am not certain how Libreoffice could handle a 500 page memo being worked by 50+ people including thousands of track chan…

Pretty sure you can edit most office documents in google docs via the browser without issue. Only additional step would be uploading them to Google Drive.

> Pretty sure you can edit most office documents in google docs via the browser without issue.

That's just the tip of the iceberg. Using Google Docs means that you're opting out of the substantial ecosystem of legal-specific Word add-ins - document templates for court filings, semantic analysis for contracts, metadata scrubbing, etc.

Re: Running a Law Firm on Linux

#167

Post by radicaldreamer » Fri, Nov 12, 2021, 7:12 PM UTC

terminalcommand wrote: post #13

Also a lawyer here, I think the biggest hurdle is MS Word. MS word is the defacto IDE of the law world. We spend most of our time in Word. The drafting of documents won't be a problem with libre office. You can send a PDF to the client. But working with other lawyers/parties could be a challenge. I am not certain how Libreoffice could handle a 500 page memo being worked by 50+ people including thousands of track chan…

Is working on a Mac as difficult?

Re: Running a Law Firm on Linux

#168

Post by bogwog » Fri, Nov 12, 2021, 7:15 PM UTC

2Gkashmiri wrote: post #11

This is nice but I have suggestions and questions. Case management. I use "cliniccases" which does most of the work but it is geared towards law clinics and does not have "billing". That can be improved but that's something. What do you use for crm ? Is that self hosted too ? There are softwares like cryptpad that solves collaborative editing problem for those used to google docs. I use mailinabox for my emails and t…

> I have been thinking of "nextcloud" but I do not see the benefit.

Nextcloud does a lot and supports "apps" for things like Google Docs-style editors in the browser. You can even do encrypted messaging, voice, and video chat with it. More here: https://apps.nextcloud.com/

If all you need is network storage, it's definitely overkill.

Re: Running a Law Firm on Linux

#169

Post by bobdupneu » Fri, Nov 12, 2021, 7:18 PM UTC

titanomachy wrote: post #153

bobdupneu wrote: post #147

French/Iranian lawyer here. Moved to Linux 5 years ago (from OS X) because Apple kept changing my workflow and suppressing functionality. Libre office proved to be better than Mac Word (better support for Persian and so called complex languages) and than windows word (could open old word documents that word itself couldn’t open any more!). Regarding ScanSnap, I replaced it with a Brother multifunctional printer that…

Running such a setup would seem to require a professional level of competence in systems administration. Do you find it challenging to maintain that alongside your legal expertise?

It is an investment in time and knowledge. But you know that your investment will not be wiped out because it doesn’t fit any more in Apple’s or Microsoft’s business plan. My workflow has become very stable since my switch to linux and opensource. Sure the software has quirks but you can always find workarounds. When I used Windows, I remember that I needed more clicks to do the same thing with every new version as Microsoft buried functionality in successive layers of UI. All in all I would say that I’m much more productive when working on a case, at the expense of spending some of my free time learning sysadmin, emacs, latex, etc. But it’s fun and I love it. You definitely need to have a level of interest in tech to go all linux in your firm.

Re: Running a Law Firm on Linux

#170

Post by tjalfi » Fri, Nov 12, 2021, 7:18 PM UTC

AnthonyMouse wrote: post #35

terminalcommand wrote: post #13

Also a lawyer here, I think the biggest hurdle is MS Word. MS word is the defacto IDE of the law world. We spend most of our time in Word. The drafting of documents won't be a problem with libre office. You can send a PDF to the client. But working with other lawyers/parties could be a challenge. I am not certain how Libreoffice could handle a 500 page memo being worked by 50+ people including thousands of track chan…

Basically all of these things are teething problems. The early adopters have problems, the problems get solved, then they're solved for everybody. What's going to be interesting is how attorney client privilege interacts with the third party doctrine and proprietary systems increasingly moving your documents to The Cloud, often without telling you or making it obvious that it's happening. That could drive early adopt…

> Basically all of these things are teething problems. The early adopters have problems, the problems get solved, then they're solved for everybody

It's not just teething problems.

Using OpenOffice and Linux means that you're opting out of the substantial ecosystem of legal-specific Word add-ins - document templates for court filings, semantic analysis for contracts, metadata scrubbing, etc. Most of these tools are only available for Windows although some of them support Macs. A small practice can get away with using Linux but a large firm would be foolish to do so.