I wonder how many people won’t buy Fortnite hats because getting their CC out is so much more friction than just charging it to your Google account.
Google will lose $50M or more in 2018 from Fortnite bypassing the Play Store
161–170 of 219 posts
Re: Google will lose $50M or more in 2018 from Fortnite bypassing the Play Store
#162I have mixed feelings about this. On the one hand, I am still a big fan of Android´s openess (at least compared to the walled garden that is iOS) and I think it should the right of every company or developer to NOT use a closed platform to distribute its app. However on the other hand, this move by Epic sets a dangerous precedent: Factually, Google get´s economically punished for being more open than Apple. This does…
There are already multiple separate app stores for Android and not just the Google Play. This is nothing new for Google to be honest.
And if they were to make Android a closed system, what would make me buy an Android phone instead of an iOS phone anymore? Openness is one of the biggest selling points for Android.
Re: Google will lose $50M or more in 2018 from Fortnite bypassing the Play Store
#163The framing of this article feels weird to me. Google offers a service (distribution), and it just so happens Fortnite doesn't need it. It also completely ignores how much Fortnite will lose from people who don't install it because they can't figure out how. A better way would be "Fortnite is big enough to bypass Google and still make $180MM", rather than acting like this is Google's fault. I mean, the fact that phon…
In a few years the media (which has always been very pro-Apple) has internalized the idea, that all your software MUST come from a single corporation controlled walled garden and pay tax to them. The whole concept of being able to install software from a source you choose is now so foreign that they'll speak against it when possible. And unfortunately, this seems to be the case with a lot of HN commenters as well.
I've been running open source, free, libre, etc software since the mid-90s. My firewall is openbsd. my laptop runs linux. I use emacs for most of my software editing. I want you to understand that I am a big open source weenie, and have been for decades.
I think asking consumers to evaluate risk of installing third party apps and manage permissions is insane. My phone runs iOS. My family the same. The volume of malware in the Play Store alone, much less in the sideloading community is mind boggling. If I ran Android I would only install software that I had written myself or come from a trusted vendor, and only use a browser (probably not Chrome even, but Firefox) for any third party content.
Any anti-walled-garden screed has to grapple with the fact that in the real world, the walled garden protects people from mass data theft and infiltration. Windows used to be like this, before many more users switched to Mac (which is harder, but not impossible) to backdoor. Replicating the internet security environment of the late 90s but on our phones would be a disaster for the technology-using world.
Re: Google will lose $50M or more in 2018 from Fortnite bypassing the Play Store
#164I wonder if this becomes a norm in the Android freemium gaming community, will they start advertising more Android ads to iPhone users. Maybe even start offering free "trade-up" program if they spend enough. If a user spends $1000, and 30% goes to Apple, that's $300 that could of bought the user a dedicated gaming device that will allow them to avoid that 30% tax. I love Apple, but 30% for in-app purchases is somethi…
> If a user spends $1000, and 30% goes to Apple, that's $300 that could of bought the user a dedicated gaming device that will allow them to avoid that 30% tax. How many iOS users willing to invest $300 on a low-end Android device to play Fortnite in order to start saving 30% after spending over $700 in in-app purchases do you think exist in the world?
Look up the term whales in this context. There are a relatively small class of users that disproportionately contribute to revenue.
That aside, the freemium gambling esque model is going to be the new cigarette addiction if it isn't already so.
Re: Google will lose $50M or more in 2018 from Fortnite bypassing the Play Store
#165Earlier quoted context omitted.
Companies pay taxes on profits, not on revenue. Google takes 30% cut of the revenue. That's quite a difference.
sure, as a private company I have a running budget based on the profits of my application. 30% of that revenue which I will never get will be going to another company which has a record of paying little to no taxes. Now, how do you think the government makes up the difference in the tax loop holes? By raising taxes on companies like mine and restricting/regulating on how I structure my profits/income so that it can s…
I think the comment was saying that it's way worse than income tax. I don't think you're disagreeing.
Re: Google will lose $50M or more in 2018 from Fortnite bypassing the Play Store
#166The framing of this article feels weird to me. Google offers a service (distribution), and it just so happens Fortnite doesn't need it. It also completely ignores how much Fortnite will lose from people who don't install it because they can't figure out how. A better way would be "Fortnite is big enough to bypass Google and still make $180MM", rather than acting like this is Google's fault. I mean, the fact that phon…
It is misleading. It would be more honest (imho) to describe Google as "missing out on" rather than "losing". I don't think you can "lose" that which you never had.
Re: Google will lose $50M or more in 2018 from Fortnite bypassing the Play Store
#167Earlier quoted context omitted.
No, Google got in trouble for mandating other companies/products to include Google products (gmail, chrome, etc) in their products (Samsung Galaxy 9, LG whatever phone, etc). Apple doesn't mandate any other company to change something with their product (Apple installs mail, calendar, music on their own iPhone, iPad, etc). They aren't using their market position to coerce another company to do something in Apple's fa…
Only Chrome, Play Store and Search app.
… and Google Play Services, which is the bigger angle and what took Android from being "open" to arguably impossible to support the bulk of "Android" software
https://stratechery.com/2018/the-european-commission-versus-...
You don't get Google Play Services without a lot of terms and conditions, and without it you can't really be a useful Android product short of trying to replace the whole store like Amazon does to questionable degrees.
Re: Google will lose $50M or more in 2018 from Fortnite bypassing the Play Store
#168Earlier quoted context omitted.
In a few years the media (which has always been very pro-Apple) has internalized the idea, that all your software MUST come from a single corporation controlled walled garden and pay tax to them. The whole concept of being able to install software from a source you choose is now so foreign that they'll speak against it when possible. And unfortunately, this seems to be the case with a lot of HN commenters as well.
I've been running open source, free, libre, etc software since the mid-90s. My firewall is openbsd. my laptop runs linux. I use emacs for most of my software editing. I want you to understand that I am a big open source weenie, and have been for decades. I think asking consumers to evaluate risk of installing third party apps and manage permissions is insane. My phone runs iOS. My family the same. The volume of malwa…
Gatekeeper on macOS is a great compromise. I wish iOS would adopt the same model.
Re: Google will lose $50M or more in 2018 from Fortnite bypassing the Play Store
#169Earlier quoted context omitted.
It’s not but it’s been that way since the first Atari game system came out.
Atari and other early consoles had unlicensed, unapproved software distributed for them legally. This did become impossible eventually as security technology improved.
It actually started in 1983 with the NES from what I can tell. NES's lockout chip was reverse engineered and Nintendo sued.
Re: Google will lose $50M or more in 2018 from Fortnite bypassing the Play Store
#170Earlier quoted context omitted.
> Apple aren't doing anything to prevent competition with their platform. This is a categorically false statement. I can point to a lot of places where Apple are doing quite a bit to prevent competition on their platform. I mean, browser engine choice is the easiest to see of dozens of ways Apple is doing something to prevent competition on their platform. Did you mean something else by your statement I do not unders…
I do mean with their platform, which is why I wrote that and not on their platform. Only offering your software on your hardware isn't anticompetitive. It's the default for almost everything - your smart fridge isn't anticompetitive because you can't install a different web browser, your modem/router isn't anticompetitive because you can't switch to openwrt, your smart toothbrush isn't anticompetitive because you can…
> Only offering your software on your hardware isn't anticompetitive
I'd say that it has been upheld that only offering your software on your platform has been ruled as anticompetitive if you are large enough. Same with prioritizing your results on your platform, etc. Regardless of if that platform is hardware or any other restricted area with a majority presence.
> your smart fridge isn't anticompetitive because you can't install a different web browser
Unfortunately, I'm afraid if you have the vast majority of the fridge market, and you lock out development for it, you very likely will be accused of anticompetitive behavior.
> This is fundamentally different from what Apple is doing, which is simply selling a product.
Yes, that is very true it is fundamentally different and the specific part about the Android licensing is anticompetitive for those reasons and Apple would not be subject to those rulings. Many of the other software installation practices that Google/Microsoft have been ruled anticompetitive for, however, are very similar to what Apple is doing and only their smaller market share prevents the violation. But we shouldn't pretend that Apple isn't doing anything to prevent competition here, just not in the way that Google did with the most recent Android ruling. Apple does plenty to prevent competition with their platform as do most companies. To say it does nothing is wrong.