Earlier quoted context omitted.
> People in general are far too immature to discuss politics. But not you, right?
Did you see hueving discussing politics?
I was just wondering if he included himself in the "people" group.
Microsoft Employees Pressure Leadership to Cancel ICE Contract
161–170 of 251 posts
Re: Microsoft Employees Pressure Leadership to Cancel ICE Contract
#162Fire every single one of those Microsoft employees. People in ICE protect me, mine, and our way of life with their lives every day of the week. I'm not going to flippantly say fuck those people because the politics of the day are making a mockery of a law that was duly imposed and enforced by both parties spanning multiple administrations because it's the fashionable political protest fad of the day. Protest the lead…
Lies. Willful lies. Absolutely everybody knows that the way these immigrants are handled changed THIS YEAR. There is no law mandating this horror. There is no concern that these children are not with their own parents (because we already knew about that possibility, and worked to identify it without wholesale kidnapping!) There is only the desire to hurt families and children in order to scare other families and chil…
>no laws
https://cdn.ca9.uscourts.gov/datastore/opinions/2016/07/06/1...
>mandating this horror
Yes, instead when the parents are arrested for breaking our laws, the children should also be placed in jail.
Hey, if we have such horrors, maybe that would seem like a deterrent to illegal border crossing? IDK.
I think it’s pretty funny that some people want to die on this hill while talking about how wonderful other countries are like Canada who has sticker immigration laws.
But whatever, I know the people most “outraged” about this don’t actually care about Mexican children.
Re: Microsoft Employees Pressure Leadership to Cancel ICE Contract
#163Re: Microsoft Employees Pressure Leadership to Cancel ICE Contract
#164> “Our current engagement with ICE is focused on moving legacy infrastructure such as mail, calendar, messaging and document management to the cloud using Azure.” I don’t understand why this makes it any better. I’m sure there’s a lot of “messaging and document management” needed to run those detainment centers. And besides, what’s going to happen in the future when they do ask to use Cognitive Services in their miss…
Child concentration camps run a lot smoother on Office 365, now on Azure! EDIT: Anyone that collaborates with ICE from this point forward is complicit. In a just world, collaborators, ICE officers, and high officials would be tried in the International Criminal Court. Following orders or making money was not an acceptable defensible at Nuremberg, nor will it be in the coming future when the US loses enough internatio…
> Child concentration camps run a lot smoother on Office 365, now on Azure!
They should add crying children as a ring-tone in Skype!
Re: Microsoft Employees Pressure Leadership to Cancel ICE Contract
#165>part of a backlash against the agency’s policy of separating children from their families at the U.S. border. Is that a policy that ICE can simply drop?
My post is describing the status quo as I understand it. I'm neither supporting nor condemning it. There is an important legal distinction which determines whether or not you're arrested and separated from your family: asylum seeker vs criminal migrant. If you walk up to the border patrol checkpoint and request asylum you will not be separated from your family. Once we make sure you're not a known criminal we basical…
Incorrect in multiple points.
- families presenting themselves at the border are being separated
- the vast majority of families being separated under this policy are first time arrivals, because what Trump has done is order prosecution of ALL arrivals
- international law says you can claim asylum after having arrived without a visa, it does not make you a criminal to do so
- under Obama, families doing so were actually released into community detention and almost universally did show up to their immigration court dates. Trump ended this program, in favor of jailing them all separately. That, just like instructing ICE to arrest and charge first time arrivals, is a policy decision and requires no change in the law for them to go back to the previous system.
Citations for all these: https://www.aclu.org/blog/immigrants-rights/immigrants-right...
Re: Microsoft Employees Pressure Leadership to Cancel ICE Contract
#166As I get older, it's becoming clear how intertwined our morality is with our politics. And how that bleeds into business, sports, religion, etc. It's nice to think of aspects of life that should be free from politics, but in reality that seems hard to achieve.
This situation in particular is more complicated than the media portrays. Separating children from parents is obviously bad, and needs to stop. Zero tolerance for illegal crossings, on the other hand, is probably actually good. The prior policy of letting anyone with children go & handing them a court date heavily incentivized human trafficking of children, because a child was a golden ticket into the USA (and indeed…
> Zero tolerance for illegal crossings, on the other hand, is probably actually good.
That's what I used to strongly believe then this weekend I listened to a Malcolm Gladwell podcast (yeah, I know, I know) and he made me think about it a bit differently.
Back when the border was super porous, immigration was more circular and cyclical. People would come into the US, work for a season, then go home. When the border became difficult and expensive to cross, people would cross the border and then stay.
There's an argument that can be made that a zero tolerance policy has created the current situation.
Re: Microsoft Employees Pressure Leadership to Cancel ICE Contract
#167Earlier quoted context omitted.
Lies. Willful lies. Absolutely everybody knows that the way these immigrants are handled changed THIS YEAR. There is no law mandating this horror. There is no concern that these children are not with their own parents (because we already knew about that possibility, and worked to identify it without wholesale kidnapping!) There is only the desire to hurt families and children in order to scare other families and chil…
>no laws https://cdn.ca9.uscourts.gov/datastore/opinions/2016/07/06/1... >mandating this horror Yes, instead when the parents are arrested for breaking our laws, the children should also be placed in jail. Hey, if we have such horrors, maybe that would seem like a deterrent to illegal border crossing? IDK. I think it’s pretty funny that some people want to die on this hill while talking about how wonderful other coun…
Flores does not mandate that
a) every arrival be prosecuted instead of just deported (or even any arrival)
b) Trump end community detention programs for immigrant families, which were very successful and far cheaper than prison under Obama
So no, there are no laws mandating this. People like you are choosing to do it because they think it will deter people from arriving here. That's not a legal mandate, it's a moral choice.
Re: Microsoft Employees Pressure Leadership to Cancel ICE Contract
#168Earlier quoted context omitted.
> Governments will always do evil. Not to everyone, all of the time - but they are by nature evil. If a lot of people assume this, then eventually behaviour happens according to the expectation. Within Netherlands I assume the government is usually there to make things better (though there are exceptions). What is considered better might be completely different, but still, it's assumed to be better. I've since have a…
The whole concept of liberalism is based on the assumption that governments are extremely dangerous and potentially evil and in need of constant control by both the public and it's own institutions. Even if it appears that a specific government or institution is doing good work, it is extremely dangerous to accept that as anything other than a temporary and potentially deceiving state of affairs. Constant distrust an…
Being poor (I would say "weak" but I really mean "not powerful") is the causation behind "doing good". Derp
Re: Microsoft Employees Pressure Leadership to Cancel ICE Contract
#169I just don't think we're tracking towards a healthy world where your email vendor pulls the plug on your contract because of your activities. I don't think any business should be allowed to deny their offering to any paying customer. Edit: Does that mean I have to sell lumber to the KKK even though they will likely burn a cross with it? Yes, unless they explicitly say they're going to. Leave those policing problems t…
> Does that mean I have to sell lumber to the KKK even though they will likely burn a cross with it? Yes, unless they explicitly say they're going to.
Then you're a slave of the state. It's not a policing problem, it's a freedom problem.
Re: Microsoft Employees Pressure Leadership to Cancel ICE Contract
#170Earlier quoted context omitted.
Governments are what happen when a group of people live in a community too large and complicated to be governed by an ad-hoc group of elders talking it out. Governments are what happen when humans want to trade in an organized fashion. Governments are what happen when people don't want to be in a constant state of conflict, inter and intra group. Governments are what happen if your community wants to live by the rule…
Government is only inevitable, only if you believe in these sets of prerequisites for constructing a government. These all can be managed without government should the people want it. It's called anarchy, not the neo-modern destructive type, but the real ideology actually sets this out very well, that government is not needed. It is to everyone's own opinion whether or not you need government and what each of us want…
>managed without government [...] It's called anarchy
If people agree to "manage" something, you'll end up with something that acts very much like a government.
The issue with talking about "anarchy" is that it's very easy to slip into semantic word games instead of looking at the underlying concept of how humans behave.
One reason "governments" or "managing" happens is that the real world has finite resources that's simultaneously desired by multiple people. E.g. there's a desirable piece of land. Since more than 1 person wants that land and since multiple can't live in the same spot, a conflict occurs. This eventually leads to a subset of people that make rules for others to follow. Whether you call that subset a "government" or "leaderless anarchy with unacknowledged rule-makers (wink)(wink)" is academic. (This is related to the joke, "we are all equal but some are more equal than others.")
If we depend on abolishing the idea of "property" to support the implementation of "anarchy", it still devolves to semantic word games because humans will invent equivalent euphemisms to "ownership" such as "99-year leases" or "temporary stewards of this land as communicated by a God", etc. Whatever people decide to call the control of that land, it's functionally equivalent to "property ownership".
This "resource limit" pattern repeats itself in the digital realm. Theoretically, there can be 7 billion people each with their own cryptocoin of which mad_tortoise_coin is one. However, these 7 billion individual blockchains are not useful. On the other hand, if people want to converge on a single blockchain cryptocurrency (such as Bitcoin) with stable attributes, a governance model will have to emerge. There's no way around it. If we still insist that we can have "anarchy" in Bitcoin because people can fork it, you eventually get "governance_0002" emerging in bitcoin_fork0002. Nobody "owns" the entire Bitcoin blockchain but nevertheless, participants still want to own pieces of it via public/private key pairs.
The collection of behavior that trends into a that's functionally equivalent to something called "government", and a that's functionally equivalent to "ownership" seems to be embedded in the human condition.