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Steve Jurvetson is out at his own VC firm after allegations of sexual harassment

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Re: Steve Jurvetson is out at his own VC firm after allegations of sexual harassment

#161

Post by jaredklewis »

hkmurakami wrote: post #27

Following these very visible and high profile falls from grace, in politics, media and entertainment, and high tech, there must be some legitimate concerns that in the near future the Billy Graham rule [1] (or lately called the Graham-Pence rule) will find more followers than before. Many men in power will instinctually and subconsciously cut out women from their professional lives more than before, to the detriment…

I think there is always a chance that a sociopath will plot to ruin your life for no perceivable self gain. A tiny, tiny chance. I’m skeptical of the actual efficacy of such strategies, like the “Pence” rule, but the main point is that designing your whole life so as to minimize the attack surface for sociopaths is completely insane. It would be like never leaving your house so as to reduce the chance of dying in a terrorist attack. And better not meet with any men either, as men can also accuse you of groping them, amazingly enough.

In many ways it seems like the Republican campaign against “voter fraud” or similar: a solution so obviously in search of a problem, that one seems sure there must be some ulterior motive.

Re: Steve Jurvetson is out at his own VC firm after allegations of sexual harassment

#162

Post by tankenmate »

MsMowz wrote: post #107
tankenmate wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sometimes it isn't just career death https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carl_Sargeant

I was talking about being falsely accused. All signs in his case are that he actually did it.

Did what? The allegations weren't even put to the "accused" let alone a court of law.

Let me be clear, I don't know whether he was guilty or not, the biggest reason being that the accusations are public.

But that's the rub, just an allegation can be enough to trigger all sorts of repercussions regardless of the guilt of the accused.

Accusations should be taken seriously unless prima facie absurd (the raped by someone who wasn't in the country for 20 years level of absurd). And in most cases should initially lead to suspension pending investigation for offences that would lead to a custodial sentence.

Firing and other forms of response where there is no way back is prejudicial and lacking natural justice.

[EDIT] added large clarification

Re: Steve Jurvetson is out at his own VC firm after allegations of sexual harassment

#163

Post by cisanti »

ghostbrainalpha wrote: post #42
hkmurakami wrote: post #27

Following these very visible and high profile falls from grace, in politics, media and entertainment, and high tech, there must be some legitimate concerns that in the near future the Billy Graham rule [1] (or lately called the Graham-Pence rule) will find more followers than before. Many men in power will instinctually and subconsciously cut out women from their professional lives more than before, to the detriment…

I know this might not be a popular opinion. But I've basically instituted a modified version of this rule for myself. Billy Graham and Mike Pence are definitely not a fountain a good ideas, but that doesn't mean this rule is that bad, despite the nonsense place it comes from. Whenever I need to have after work dinner/social communication with a female associate after 5:00pm, I just go out of my way to invite another…

"I don't ever comment on their physical appearance even if they got a great hair cut."

Why is that? I'm not American so I don't understand, is it because of self-defense against allegations or because you see it inappropriate?

Either way, I think you guys are a bit nuts over there, avoiding normal human interaction between genders, or people in general, is the solution?

Re: Steve Jurvetson is out at his own VC firm after allegations of sexual harassment

#164

Post by andygates »

jparse wrote: post #100
egwynn wrote: post #76

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I dunno if I’d say that makes you a jerk, but it strikes me as maybe a little overcautious. As with any security/safety issue, I think it comes down to the threat model you’re using. What’s the attack vector you’re protecting against? How likely is it that any attempt on that vector will succeed? What’s the damage if it succeeds? Speaking for myself, it never seems like I need to go too far out of my normal mode in o…

The threat model is an accusation. You are toast if you even get one accusation because it is cheaper to just get rid of you even if you are innocent. Frankly, I think he is not being cautious enough because the term "sexual harassment" has also moved into the realm of disagreement. Maybe you don't like her work and criticize it or maybe you are her boss and not agreeing with her performance. Most women quickly figur…

> You are toast if you even get one accusation

Except that's not what we're seeing; we're seeing one spiral into historical many. It's not a witch hunt, it's a reckoning.

Re: Steve Jurvetson is out at his own VC firm after allegations of sexual harassment

#165

Post by ceejayoz »

abiox wrote: post #133
ceejayoz wrote: post #114

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've read that article twice and nowhere does it indicate he was cleared of the accusations.

how does one become 'cleared of accusations'?

Police investigation? Parliamentary one? Alibis, inconsistencies in the story, etc.? People are cleared of alleged crimes/improprieties all the time.

Re: Steve Jurvetson is out at his own VC firm after allegations of sexual harassment

#166

Post by vfulco »

ghostbrainalpha wrote: post #42
hkmurakami wrote: post #27

Following these very visible and high profile falls from grace, in politics, media and entertainment, and high tech, there must be some legitimate concerns that in the near future the Billy Graham rule [1] (or lately called the Graham-Pence rule) will find more followers than before. Many men in power will instinctually and subconsciously cut out women from their professional lives more than before, to the detriment…

I know this might not be a popular opinion. But I've basically instituted a modified version of this rule for myself. Billy Graham and Mike Pence are definitely not a fountain a good ideas, but that doesn't mean this rule is that bad, despite the nonsense place it comes from. Whenever I need to have after work dinner/social communication with a female associate after 5:00pm, I just go out of my way to invite another…

And in a zero tolerance corporation, you could still be whacked after decades of service, because someone says so.

Re: Steve Jurvetson is out at his own VC firm after allegations of sexual harassment

#167

Post by xray123 »

s17n wrote: post #152
jparse wrote: post #131

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I am not sure SFJ is guilty. Basically, he was overly critical of ideas and pitches he received. The opposing party had their feelings hurt which they attribute to them being female.

Well given that afaik nothing has been said publicly, there's not much to discuss, but I doubt that he would have been ousted from DFJ without a reason. It is of course possible that this is DFJ freaking out and cutting him loose despite his innocence but that is not the most likely explanation.

Witnessed firsthand Jurvetson say wildly inappropriate thing to female VC he literally just met. He remarked about her necklace that it looked like a choker and did she also have "a ballgag"? He also used to flash a slide in his standard pitch deck, which he presented all over the world, about the impressive "software" at DFJ. The slide would show a photo of all the young female exec assts. He would then pause and smile to an audience of predominantly men. Usually it wouldn't get any laughs; not sure if anyone really appreciated the joke. Steve is a brilliant visionary but clearly has some difficulty understanding right from wrong behavior. On some level I feel sorry for him but I unhesitatingly believe DFJ ousted him due to the mountain of evidence they uncovered during their investigation.

Re: Steve Jurvetson is out at his own VC firm after allegations of sexual harassment

#168

Post by ghostbrainalpha »

cisanti wrote: post #163
ghostbrainalpha wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I know this might not be a popular opinion. But I've basically instituted a modified version of this rule for myself. Billy Graham and Mike Pence are definitely not a fountain a good ideas, but that doesn't mean this rule is that bad, despite the nonsense place it comes from. Whenever I need to have after work dinner/social communication with a female associate after 5:00pm, I just go out of my way to invite another…

"I don't ever comment on their physical appearance even if they got a great hair cut." Why is that? I'm not American so I don't understand, is it because of self-defense against allegations or because you see it inappropriate? Either way, I think you guys are a bit nuts over there, avoiding normal human interaction between genders, or people in general, is the solution?

Compliments on physical appearance can signal some type of sexual interest.

I give PLENTY of compliments throughout the day. But I keep it limited to someone's thought's, actions, attitude, and quality of work.

Re: Steve Jurvetson is out at his own VC firm after allegations of sexual harassment

#169

Post by vfulco »

jparse wrote: post #100
egwynn wrote: post #76

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I dunno if I’d say that makes you a jerk, but it strikes me as maybe a little overcautious. As with any security/safety issue, I think it comes down to the threat model you’re using. What’s the attack vector you’re protecting against? How likely is it that any attempt on that vector will succeed? What’s the damage if it succeeds? Speaking for myself, it never seems like I need to go too far out of my normal mode in o…

The threat model is an accusation. You are toast if you even get one accusation because it is cheaper to just get rid of you even if you are innocent. Frankly, I think he is not being cautious enough because the term "sexual harassment" has also moved into the realm of disagreement. Maybe you don't like her work and criticize it or maybe you are her boss and not agreeing with her performance. Most women quickly figur…

Exactly what happened to a buddy of mine. Super fast tracker at wall street investment bank. female junior analyst could not cut it in the 80 hour work week, rough and tumble world. One month before review season, she cries "harrassment". he gets whacked, she survived another few months until the employer finally came around to understand she was sub-par. Could have ruined a career if he wasn't such a superstar and bounced back hugely. Story could have been a lot worse for him. Don't work with, hire, or mentor women is the message being clearly sent.

Re: Steve Jurvetson is out at his own VC firm after allegations of sexual harassment

#170

Post by ghostbrainalpha »

jparse wrote: post #100
egwynn wrote: post #76

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I dunno if I’d say that makes you a jerk, but it strikes me as maybe a little overcautious. As with any security/safety issue, I think it comes down to the threat model you’re using. What’s the attack vector you’re protecting against? How likely is it that any attempt on that vector will succeed? What’s the damage if it succeeds? Speaking for myself, it never seems like I need to go too far out of my normal mode in o…

The threat model is an accusation. You are toast if you even get one accusation because it is cheaper to just get rid of you even if you are innocent. Frankly, I think he is not being cautious enough because the term "sexual harassment" has also moved into the realm of disagreement. Maybe you don't like her work and criticize it or maybe you are her boss and not agreeing with her performance. Most women quickly figur…

> we do walking meetings around the block in public areas.

>> Please don't do this.

Can you please explain? Walking meetings are quite popular in my network. I thought this is a pretty safe trend.

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