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U.K. demand for a back door to Apple data threatens Americans, lawmakers say

washingtonpost.com

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Re: U.K. demand for a back door to Apple data threatens Americans, lawmakers say

#151

Post by Kudos »

Nifty3929 wrote: post #128

I keep saying this, and nobody believes me, but I'm just going to keep trying: These things happen because so often we focus the privacy conversation on corporations, which is exactly where the governments want it to be. My controversial but strong opinion is that privacy from corporations matters very little, but privacy from governments matters very much. We need to stop allowing the conversation to get distracted…

FYI, it's widely known that the US government has being buying citizen data from data brokers.

Re: U.K. demand for a back door to Apple data threatens Americans, lawmakers say

#152

Post by ta1243 »

Nifty3929 wrote: post #128

I keep saying this, and nobody believes me, but I'm just going to keep trying: These things happen because so often we focus the privacy conversation on corporations, which is exactly where the governments want it to be. My controversial but strong opinion is that privacy from corporations matters very little, but privacy from governments matters very much. We need to stop allowing the conversation to get distracted…

I can hold my government accountable via the polling booth

I have no control over Apple or Amazon or Alphabet. I can petition the government through the court system if it tries to put me in jail, the government functions with a massive series of checks and balances.

I can't petition google, they are an unelected uncontrollable unaccountable entity that not even the government has power over

Re: U.K. demand for a back door to Apple data threatens Americans, lawmakers say

#153

Post by [deleted] »

graeme wrote: post #31
varsketiz wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> This is a dramatic overreach of authority. Well, the rest of the world lives with the USA constantly doing this. Hopefully you dont support that as well.

The US does not require Apple to make a backdoor to its encryption.

[deleted]

Re: U.K. demand for a back door to Apple data threatens Americans, lawmakers say

#154

Post by neogodless »

ta1243 wrote: post #152
Nifty3929 wrote: post #128

I keep saying this, and nobody believes me, but I'm just going to keep trying: These things happen because so often we focus the privacy conversation on corporations, which is exactly where the governments want it to be. My controversial but strong opinion is that privacy from corporations matters very little, but privacy from governments matters very much. We need to stop allowing the conversation to get distracted…

I can hold my government accountable via the polling booth I have no control over Apple or Amazon or Alphabet. I can petition the government through the court system if it tries to put me in jail, the government functions with a massive series of checks and balances. I can't petition google, they are an unelected uncontrollable unaccountable entity that not even the government has power over

It's easier to not buy an iPhone than it was trying to prevent a politician I didn't trust from getting in office.

In either case, collective action is, at best, the best you're going to have.

Do regulations not have meaning?

Re: U.K. demand for a back door to Apple data threatens Americans, lawmakers say

#155

Post by hnlmorg »

impossiblefork wrote: post #148
hnlmorg wrote: post #90

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I really don’t like the UK governments stance on cyber security / counter-terrorism / et al either. In fact, as a UK citizen I’ve actively campaigned against a great many of their policies. However this “thought police” and “arrested for posting memes” comment that often gets pointed on here is itself a nonsense meme. What actually happened was people were arrested for instigating riots. This is no different to what…

People have been arrested for perfectly legal anti-royalist propaganda, and threatened with arrest for such things as protesting by holding a blank sheet of paper, so I don't agree.

Citation needed

Re: U.K. demand for a back door to Apple data threatens Americans, lawmakers say

#156

Post by ta1243 »

neogodless wrote: post #154
ta1243 wrote: post #152

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I can hold my government accountable via the polling booth I have no control over Apple or Amazon or Alphabet. I can petition the government through the court system if it tries to put me in jail, the government functions with a massive series of checks and balances. I can't petition google, they are an unelected uncontrollable unaccountable entity that not even the government has power over

It's easier to not buy an iPhone than it was trying to prevent a politician I didn't trust from getting in office. In either case, collective action is, at best, the best you're going to have. Do regulations not have meaning?

You might think you're safe because you don't carry a phone, never upload a photo, etc. You drove across the country in a car you paid cash for while bemoaning cameras that catch you speeding, in the name of "privacy". Meanwhile meta knows exactly where you are as their face recognition attached it to your shadow profile when someone took a selfie with you in the background, you were seen on a ring doorbell by amazon as you walked down the street

This "individualism" and "I'm alright jack" approach is a fallacy the world can't afford.

My government doesn't have a copy of my family tree or a good idea what my DNA is. Ancestry.com does.

Re: U.K. demand for a back door to Apple data threatens Americans, lawmakers say

#157

Post by sneak »

Nifty3929 wrote: post #128

I keep saying this, and nobody believes me, but I'm just going to keep trying: These things happen because so often we focus the privacy conversation on corporations, which is exactly where the governments want it to be. My controversial but strong opinion is that privacy from corporations matters very little, but privacy from governments matters very much. We need to stop allowing the conversation to get distracted…

Apple gives data to the United States government on over 70,000 user accounts per year without a warrant.

Anything Apple knows, the FBI can know, without probable cause.

Re: U.K. demand for a back door to Apple data threatens Americans, lawmakers say

#158

Post by matt-p »

quesera wrote: post #109
matt-p wrote: post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Right. Who would be the first country the US might go to if it wanted to spy on it's citizens from abroad? Perhaps one who already does this for them using other methods such as wire tapping?

Are you suggesting that the UK government isn't snoopy or creative enough to initiate this idea on their own??

No. Maybe it was their idea, maybe it was the US's. One thing's for sure though we wouldn't be pushing ahead with this without the tacit support of the US, particularly in the current environment.

Re: U.K. demand for a back door to Apple data threatens Americans, lawmakers say

#159

Post by JKCalhoun »

Nifty3929 wrote: post #128

I keep saying this, and nobody believes me, but I'm just going to keep trying: These things happen because so often we focus the privacy conversation on corporations, which is exactly where the governments want it to be. My controversial but strong opinion is that privacy from corporations matters very little, but privacy from governments matters very much. We need to stop allowing the conversation to get distracted…

> we focus the privacy conversation on corporations

Focus on government, cool. Is the government tracking me with cookies, offering cloud services, tracking me with ads, and whatnot?

Sorry, but we should talk about privacy at the source of where we are losing it.

In fact, it might even be easier to make the case that corporations want our focus to be on privacy at the state level and not their brand.

Re: U.K. demand for a back door to Apple data threatens Americans, lawmakers say

#160

Post by sneak »

What the UK is asking for is largely already provided to them by Apple: Apple can already read everyone’s photos and notes, and the so-called e2ee iMessage because the messages are included in the non-e2ee backups.

Approximately nobody has enabled the optional e2ee for iCloud, so the five eyes have warrantless access to everything Apple has.

This is mostly posturing and reinforcement of the status quo.

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