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Google won't be mandating a strict return-to-office plan

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Re: Google won't be mandating a strict return-to-office plan

#151

Post by hiatus »

donkers wrote: post #101
ryandrake wrote: post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> * I think the rumored record of multiple full time jobs someone was working was 5+. > * We interviewed someone who was upfront they would be working for us while working for her full time day job remotely. I'm not sure how this is justified as a problem. CEO of multiple companies: A-OK SVP serving on multiple companies' boards of directors: A-OK Salaried office worker working for multiple companies remotely: Fraud…

I wouldn't call it fraud, but it is probably violating the terms of the employment contract. I know it is for my company (I bet people still do it anyway)

What's the recourse for violating your employment contract beyond termination? Ineligibility for unemployment because you were fired "for cause"? Seems like it's worth the risk since you can be fired for no reason at all.

Re: Google won't be mandating a strict return-to-office plan

#152

Post by antisthenes »

Spooky23 wrote: post #115
blackeyeblitzar wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Do cities actually subsidize suburban infrastructure? I am skeptical but I don’t know all of the details on how people come to that conclusion. What happens if the economy is more spread out? Also a lot of the people that own and run companies that give a city its tax base live in the suburban areas. It might even be reasonable to say that they are the ones subsidizing the city and not the other way. How do you think…

Suburbs in general are losers from a government operations perspective. They work because they are mostly newish. Core functions like keeping roads functional rely on state and federal aid. Many older suburbs are more in decline now. Especially in 2nd/3rd tier metro areas. It’s just less obvious than the inner city or rural areas. They need growth to thrive. Once they fill out, population ages out, schools decline, a…

Suburban infrastructure is usually much more sparse, of lower quality and a lot of it is shifted to the local business/homeowner.

As an example - city water vs Water wells & Septic tank/fields. Gravel roads without sidewalks, etc.

So it's not 100% evident that cities subsidize rural counties. Cities do provide the larger tax base for states, which probably subsidize more rural counties through incentives tied to certain rural activities, but making a blanket statement is probably not accurate.

Re: Google won't be mandating a strict return-to-office plan

#153

Post by technick »

nostromo wrote: post #137
xyst wrote: post #12

They say this now. But in 12 months (or the next layoff period), they will move from hybrid to full RTO. Still a shitty move to mandate RTO. Most people (IT folks) have spoke with do this routine: 0) daily routine to prepare for day 1) 1 hr commute to shitty office 2) login to computer, do calls with cross regional (and international) teams over Zoom/Teams/Webex or whatever conferencing system 3) teleconferencing wit…

You're forgetting that a lot of people still have to WFH, they just do it now before or after going to the office - so it's even worse than you're stating. I know some folks that work from the west coast with customers on the east coast, and they regularly are taking meetings at 6am from home, then commuting in, and getting home late. If we return to the office, we should not also be expected to work long hours when…

I was told at a previous job I couldn't work from home but they expected me to take my laptop home with me just in case something happened. My response was I couldn't work from home and just left my laptop at work.

Re: Google won't be mandating a strict return-to-office plan

#154

Post by deciplex »

BeetleB wrote: post #138
xyst wrote: post #12

They say this now. But in 12 months (or the next layoff period), they will move from hybrid to full RTO. Still a shitty move to mandate RTO. Most people (IT folks) have spoke with do this routine: 0) daily routine to prepare for day 1) 1 hr commute to shitty office 2) login to computer, do calls with cross regional (and international) teams over Zoom/Teams/Webex or whatever conferencing system 3) teleconferencing wit…

I think if you're required to RTO, you should insist on not having Zoom/Teams/Webex on while in the office. "Come to my cube if you need me". Way before the pandemic, I almost never had those tools running on my work laptop - unless it was for a (rare at the time) cross-geo meeting. A coworker once sent me a screenshot of how I appeared in the IM tool - Last seen 120 days ago . Sadly, that went away once we hired our…

If you're required to RTO and doing it you probably aren't in a position to "insist" on jack shit.

Re: Google won't be mandating a strict return-to-office plan

#155

Post by deciplex »

nostromo wrote: post #137
xyst wrote: post #12

They say this now. But in 12 months (or the next layoff period), they will move from hybrid to full RTO. Still a shitty move to mandate RTO. Most people (IT folks) have spoke with do this routine: 0) daily routine to prepare for day 1) 1 hr commute to shitty office 2) login to computer, do calls with cross regional (and international) teams over Zoom/Teams/Webex or whatever conferencing system 3) teleconferencing wit…

You're forgetting that a lot of people still have to WFH, they just do it now before or after going to the office - so it's even worse than you're stating. I know some folks that work from the west coast with customers on the east coast, and they regularly are taking meetings at 6am from home, then commuting in, and getting home late. If we return to the office, we should not also be expected to work long hours when…

>It's the worst of both words.

And it's quickly becoming the status quo.

They really don't ever let a disaster go to waste, do they?

Re: Google won't be mandating a strict return-to-office plan

#156

Post by 10xalphadev »

epolanski wrote: post #133
ryandrake wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

When I lived in the Bay Area, my commute was ~2.5 hours each way. I would have killed for a 1 hour commute.

I find it absurd how Americans can't give up on their suburbs and car centric development dystopia and then spend so much time in their cars.

I live within an European city - not downtown, but relatively close. My commute by car over ~10km is 18-20 mins, same distance by public transport takes 40-50 mins, depending on train reliability and workers not striking.

So change my mind?

Re: Google won't be mandating a strict return-to-office plan

#157

Post by [deleted] »

whstl wrote: post #48
xyst wrote: post #12

They say this now. But in 12 months (or the next layoff period), they will move from hybrid to full RTO. Still a shitty move to mandate RTO. Most people (IT folks) have spoke with do this routine: 0) daily routine to prepare for day 1) 1 hr commute to shitty office 2) login to computer, do calls with cross regional (and international) teams over Zoom/Teams/Webex or whatever conferencing system 3) teleconferencing wit…

> There are _some_ roles which may require in-person IME when working in a Product role, it worked better from the office. Doesn't have to be every day, but being able to talk directly to people is much better than having to schedule meetings. Tech positions don't even need daily video calls IMO. My team experimented with a few days of written status updates and it was fine. But they chose to have a 10-mins stand-up…

[deleted]

Re: Google won't be mandating a strict return-to-office plan

#158

Post by RobRivera »

epolanski wrote: post #133
ryandrake wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

When I lived in the Bay Area, my commute was ~2.5 hours each way. I would have killed for a 1 hour commute.

I find it absurd how Americans can't give up on their suburbs and car centric development dystopia and then spend so much time in their cars.

Yes, we Americans love our cars, oil, wars, wwf, and guns.

Re: Google won't be mandating a strict return-to-office plan

#159

Post by saturn8601 »

Spooky23 wrote: post #50
stego-tech wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I mean, my experience says you’re right, but the red hot labor summer combined with Dell and Amazon _and_ Apple workers vocally opposing such mandates and leaving outright give me hope that maybe, _maybe_ leadership will accept this is a losing battle and embrace the new norms. Barring that, the younger working demographics have made it abundantly clear there’s a zero tolerance for the traditional corporate bullshit.…

Tech organizations are all overstaffed from the pandemic. Engineering is usually boom/bust. Likely outcome is recession and purge. The plucky gen alphas will be in the cube farm to pay they rent.

>The plucky gen alphas will be in the cube farm to pay they rent.

Gen alpha? You're talking about a generation that the oldest cohort is ~10-11 years of age.

Will there even be enough of them given their potential parents can't afford a house? Will they go into tech after seeing this "learn to code" cohort getting screwed in the marketplace?

Re: Google won't be mandating a strict return-to-office plan

#160

Post by worstspotgain »

RobRivera wrote: post #158
epolanski wrote: post #133

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I find it absurd how Americans can't give up on their suburbs and car centric development dystopia and then spend so much time in their cars.

Yes, we Americans love our cars, oil, wars, wwf, and guns.

Well at least we still donate to preserve endangered species. 1 out of 5 ain't bad!
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