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Heroku Pulls Sponsorship After Boston API Jam Publishes Sexist Eventbrite

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Re: Heroku Pulls Sponsorship After Boston API Jam Publishes Sexist Eventbrite

#151

Post by natep »

toomuchtodo wrote: post #115
natep wrote: post #77

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So, the tech industry is dominated by men, and this announcement was intended for the tech industry, so it's fine by you that it was addressed exclusively to men? It's OK that any techy woman reading it might stay clear so that they are not mistaken for being a server and/or don't have to put up with sexism like this? In what other situations do you not feel that the minority do not have rights?

Yes, because you clearly have no rights if you're mistaken for an employee at an event. How does offering to have women bring you beer at an event take away your rights? Shall we be boycotting Oktoberfest next?

Their right to be treated as equal. How would you like it if a predominantly female group was told there would be men serving drinks? Predominantly racist group told there would be blacks serving drinks?

Some people might see it as a poor attempt at humor and not demeaning to women, but I'm sure others saw it as a reinforcement of their beliefs that women are for serving beer. When everyone laughs along, because they know nobody 'really means it' it sends these people the message that their views are OK and widely accepted.

Re: Heroku Pulls Sponsorship After Boston API Jam Publishes Sexist Eventbrite

#152

Post by natep »

nirvdrum wrote: post #82
toomuchtodo wrote: post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And what if it doesn't offend them? Just because it offends you doesn't mean it should condemn them. Men like women. Men are, speaking factually, the extreme majority in the tech industry. Don't be shocked if your values don't match those of others.

Upvoted. And I just wanted to give some encouragement. It's become commonplace here to get downvoted not because you're belligerent or off-topic, but simply because you hold an opposing viewpoint. Please don't let that discourage you from participating in conversations here.

I can somewhat understand the downvoters in this case. The discussion at hand is "should we accept objectification of women in the tech industry" with opinions ranging from "No, nothing even resembling that" (paraphrased) to "It's not that big a deal"[1]. To those closer to the first stance, we don't want those kinds of opinions to gain traction here, in this community. I've done that by commenting, others by downvoting. Ideally, every comment would get a response, but there are more of these "it's not a big deal" than there are original ideas being expressed. Really, the top comment[2] should be enough to convince you that this was not an OK move on API Jam's part.

[1] http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=3731608

[2] http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=3731725

Re: Heroku Pulls Sponsorship After Boston API Jam Publishes Sexist Eventbrite

#153

Post by [deleted] »

tptacek wrote: post #32
ellyagg wrote: post #29

Whenever people get outraged about things like this, it interests me. I like looking at attractive women. I like programming. Would it be possible to have an event where I could program and look at attractive women at the same time? Or does enjoying seeing attractive women in public make me a bad person? As a man, is this my original sin? In fact, I've even been known to flirt with attractive women in public--perhaps…

What the hell are you talking about? Medical doctors are not "mostly men". Roughly 50% of all medical students are women, and current trends have women overtaking men in the profession long term. "I very much doubt the dearth of women in technology is because men are sexual predators". Sheesh. I agree. Comments like this do the job just fine, too.

[deleted]

Re: Heroku Pulls Sponsorship After Boston API Jam Publishes Sexist Eventbrite

#154

Post by toomuchtodo »

natep wrote: post #151
toomuchtodo wrote: post #115

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, because you clearly have no rights if you're mistaken for an employee at an event. How does offering to have women bring you beer at an event take away your rights? Shall we be boycotting Oktoberfest next?

Their right to be treated as equal. How would you like it if a predominantly female group was told there would be men serving drinks? Predominantly racist group told there would be blacks serving drinks? Some people might see it as a poor attempt at humor and not demeaning to women, but I'm sure others saw it as a reinforcement of their beliefs that women are for serving beer. When everyone laughs along, because they…

I'm completely OK with a predominately female group being told men would be there serving drinks? African americans serving racists? That's a totally different ballgame.

Re: Heroku Pulls Sponsorship After Boston API Jam Publishes Sexist Eventbrite

#155

Post by euroclydon »

bermanoid wrote: post #113
tptacek wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What the hell are you talking about? Medical doctors are not "mostly men". Roughly 50% of all medical students are women, and current trends have women overtaking men in the profession long term. "I very much doubt the dearth of women in technology is because men are sexual predators". Sheesh. I agree. Comments like this do the job just fine, too.

What the hell are you talking about? Medical doctors are not "mostly men". Roughly 50% of all medical students are women, and current trends have women overtaking men in the profession long term. Hiding somewhere in the rest of that somewhat nonsensical comment (ellyagg's, I mean, not yours, tptacek) is the kernel of a fairly good question, related to what you're saying here: why is it that in almost every other once…

1) it's a younger field

2) unlike law and medicine, it's only recently been identified as being lucrative

3) the path to success is much more blurry as there is no guild or accreditation

4) because of the top three, parents don't push their daughters toward programming.

Re: Heroku Pulls Sponsorship After Boston API Jam Publishes Sexist Eventbrite

#156

Post by natep »

toomuchtodo wrote: post #154
natep wrote: post #151

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Their right to be treated as equal. How would you like it if a predominantly female group was told there would be men serving drinks? Predominantly racist group told there would be blacks serving drinks? Some people might see it as a poor attempt at humor and not demeaning to women, but I'm sure others saw it as a reinforcement of their beliefs that women are for serving beer. When everyone laughs along, because they…

I'm completely OK with a predominately female group being told men would be there serving drinks? African americans serving racists? That's a totally different ballgame.

OK, so how about blacks serving a predominantly white group? I think my other race metaphor went too far, but this one works. There's nothing wrong with a black person working as a server/waiter. They're still considered by most people to be completely equal, and blacks are welcome to participate in the event alongside whites, it just so happens that their drinks will be brought by blacks.

If you don't think it's fair to compare racism and sexism, I suggest reading this Person Paper: http://www.cs.virginia.edu/~evans/cs655/readings/purity.html

Re: Heroku Pulls Sponsorship After Boston API Jam Publishes Sexist Eventbrite

#157

Post by [deleted] »

sequoia wrote: post #84

When I got to this thread the top comment (by ellyagg) 100% missed the point. He seemed to think people were upset by the idea of sexuality, or offended that a man might be attracted to a woman. Sexuality or sexual orientation is not the issue. The commodification of women is the issue. When you list "Women!" as a feature of your event along with "Booze", "Gym Access", and "Food Truck" wares [1], you are treating the…

[deleted]

Re: Heroku Pulls Sponsorship After Boston API Jam Publishes Sexist Eventbrite

#158

Post by niete »

sequoia wrote: post #84

When I got to this thread the top comment (by ellyagg) 100% missed the point. He seemed to think people were upset by the idea of sexuality, or offended that a man might be attracted to a woman. Sexuality or sexual orientation is not the issue. The commodification of women is the issue. When you list "Women!" as a feature of your event along with "Booze", "Gym Access", and "Food Truck" wares [1], you are treating the…

When I tell my friend that he should come to my party because a bunch of really cool people will be there, didn't I just commodify them too? OH THE HORROR.

When you apply English class style logic you can make anything seem as bad the holocaust.

Re: Heroku Pulls Sponsorship After Boston API Jam Publishes Sexist Eventbrite

#159

Post by avand »

brown9-2 wrote: post #25
gamache wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't like that Boston is in the headline. People do notice these things.

Then shouldn't you be angry at the Boston API Jam people, not people 300 miles away who have nothing to do with this?

Hey, I'm one of the co-founders of Sqoot. We're a small startup trying to do big things. Sometimes we trip and fall. This is one of those times. In hindsight, our language was reckless & immature. Please accept our apology:

http://blog.sqoot.com/we-can-do-better-an-apology-from-sqoot

Re: Heroku Pulls Sponsorship After Boston API Jam Publishes Sexist Eventbrite

#160

Post by avand »

Hey, I'm one of the co-founders of Sqoot. We're a small startup trying to do big things. Sometimes we trip and fall. This is one of those times. In hindsight, our language was reckless & immature. Please accept our apology:

http://blog.sqoot.com/we-can-do-better-an-apology-from-sqoot

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