Heroku Pulls Sponsorship After Boston API Jam Publishes Sexist Eventbrite • Hacker News Board

Re: Heroku Pulls Sponsorship After Boston API Jam Publishes Sexist Eventbrite

#31

Post by dmor » Tue, Mar 20, 2012, 9:03 PM UTC

ellyagg wrote: post #29

Whenever people get outraged about things like this, it interests me. I like looking at attractive women. I like programming. Would it be possible to have an event where I could program and look at attractive women at the same time? Or does enjoying seeing attractive women in public make me a bad person? As a man, is this my original sin? In fact, I've even been known to flirt with attractive women in public--perhaps…

I don't think there is anything wrong with appreciating and looking at attractive women, that isn't sexism. The problem here is marketing the event with "perks" that put women in a submissive position to men by default. Its not going to create an environment when female developers want to come hang out and hack, because it leads to those awkward "Are you a beer girl, are a coder?" conversations.

FWIW you can totally look at attractive women while programming, without objectifying them at a hackathon -- that's what the Internet was made for.

Re: Heroku Pulls Sponsorship After Boston API Jam Publishes Sexist Eventbrite

#32

Post by tptacek » Tue, Mar 20, 2012, 9:05 PM UTC

ellyagg wrote: post #29

Whenever people get outraged about things like this, it interests me. I like looking at attractive women. I like programming. Would it be possible to have an event where I could program and look at attractive women at the same time? Or does enjoying seeing attractive women in public make me a bad person? As a man, is this my original sin? In fact, I've even been known to flirt with attractive women in public--perhaps…

What the hell are you talking about? Medical doctors are not "mostly men". Roughly 50% of all medical students are women, and current trends have women overtaking men in the profession long term.

"I very much doubt the dearth of women in technology is because men are sexual predators". Sheesh. I agree. Comments like this do the job just fine, too.

Re: Heroku Pulls Sponsorship After Boston API Jam Publishes Sexist Eventbrite

#33

Post by martingordon » Tue, Mar 20, 2012, 9:07 PM UTC

brown9-2 wrote: post #25

gamache wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't like that Boston is in the headline. People do notice these things.

Then shouldn't you be angry at the Boston API Jam people, not people 300 miles away who have nothing to do with this?

I think he may be referring to the fact that Sqoot, the event organizer, is based out of NYC (and Chicago) but:

> Sqoot was founded in 2010 at DreamIt Ventures, a startup incubator based in Philadelphia & NYC. We're a scrappy team in beautiful Chicago & NYC.

From: http://www.sqoot.com/about

Re: Heroku Pulls Sponsorship After Boston API Jam Publishes Sexist Eventbrite

#34

Post by gamache » Tue, Mar 20, 2012, 9:07 PM UTC

brown9-2 wrote: post #25

gamache wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't like that Boston is in the headline. People do notice these things.

Then shouldn't you be angry at the Boston API Jam people, not people 300 miles away who have nothing to do with this?

The Boston API Jam was being put on principally by Sqoot, who are a NYC-based deals API company. Presumably they were trying to drum up interest in their platform.

Now, see? Even you thought Boston had something to do with this!

Re: Heroku Pulls Sponsorship After Boston API Jam Publishes Sexist Eventbrite

#35

Post by alinajaf » Tue, Mar 20, 2012, 9:08 PM UTC

ellyagg wrote: post #29

Whenever people get outraged about things like this, it interests me. I like looking at attractive women. I like programming. Would it be possible to have an event where I could program and look at attractive women at the same time? Or does enjoying seeing attractive women in public make me a bad person? As a man, is this my original sin? In fact, I've even been known to flirt with attractive women in public--perhaps…

> Would it be possible to have an event where I could program and look at attractive women at the same time? Or does enjoying seeing attractive women in public make me a bad person? As a man, is this my original sin?

No, I don't think it's wrong to program and look at attractive women at the same time. I also think that dating/flirting at work is mostly harmless.

That has little to do with the above described situation though. What they manage to do with just that one line is alienate anyone that doesn't have the same sexual preferences to you. If they had left gender out of it and just had attractive staff of both sexes, then to me it wouldn't offend anyone (though it would seem as you say, a little bit out of place).

Re: Heroku Pulls Sponsorship After Boston API Jam Publishes Sexist Eventbrite

#36

Post by byrneseyeview » Tue, Mar 20, 2012, 9:08 PM UTC

A general question: when someone says something offensive, the apology is often "We're sorry: we thought this was funny, but obviously it wasn't, so we've changed it."

This seems to get universally condemned, and lots of people argue that it's wrong to say "I'm sorry you're offended." But what are the alternatives? I suppose they could have said that they were deliberately sexist and hoped to hurt people's feelings, or something. I'm not sure. What--aside from groveling--do people want when they aren't satisfied with that kind of apology? It's scarily reminiscent of the way cults and authoritarian regimes function: it's not enough to confess a mistake. You have to confess your malice, too. (I wish I had some examples that weren't so fraught, but that's all I can think of: The Gulag Archipelago, various ex-Scientology memoirs, and lots of interactions with political correctness.)

For what it's worth, I agree that the copy was lame, and the sponsors were right to disassociate themselves. I'm just not sure it's a mortal sin to make a tacky joke and then apologize.

Re: Heroku Pulls Sponsorship After Boston API Jam Publishes Sexist Eventbrite

#37

Post by [deleted] » Tue, Mar 20, 2012, 9:09 PM UTC

ellyagg wrote: post #29

Whenever people get outraged about things like this, it interests me. I like looking at attractive women. I like programming. Would it be possible to have an event where I could program and look at attractive women at the same time? Or does enjoying seeing attractive women in public make me a bad person? As a man, is this my original sin? In fact, I've even been known to flirt with attractive women in public--perhaps…

[deleted]

Re: Heroku Pulls Sponsorship After Boston API Jam Publishes Sexist Eventbrite

#38

Post by rauljara » Tue, Mar 20, 2012, 9:09 PM UTC

ellyagg wrote: post #29

Whenever people get outraged about things like this, it interests me. I like looking at attractive women. I like programming. Would it be possible to have an event where I could program and look at attractive women at the same time? Or does enjoying seeing attractive women in public make me a bad person? As a man, is this my original sin? In fact, I've even been known to flirt with attractive women in public--perhaps…

The marketing material assumed that the people reading it would be heterosexual men, and gave no consideration to the idea that a woman might actually want to attend an event. Finding women attractive is not a sin. Assuming the whole world should revolve around what you find attractive without giving any consideration to the other half of the world's population is sexist. Not "I hate women" sexist. Just "women don't really qualify as people the same way men do in my mind, and no I've never really thought very hard about it" sexist.

Re: Heroku Pulls Sponsorship After Boston API Jam Publishes Sexist Eventbrite

#39

Post by ry0ohki » Tue, Mar 20, 2012, 9:09 PM UTC

ellyagg wrote: post #29

Whenever people get outraged about things like this, it interests me. I like looking at attractive women. I like programming. Would it be possible to have an event where I could program and look at attractive women at the same time? Or does enjoying seeing attractive women in public make me a bad person? As a man, is this my original sin? In fact, I've even been known to flirt with attractive women in public--perhaps…

I'm a strong believer that evolution/sex are the primary drivers for almost everything we do in life. The outrage in the comment thread here is part of the "pretend it's not like that" mentality. I'm sure the marketing people here senselessly thought "hey we want lots of programmers, most programmers are guys, what do guys like, girls!". I'm not offended by this, but it is clear they are alienating women (and homosexual men). If it was reversed; "lots of hot men serving beers", guys probably wouldn't be in a rush to show up either.

Re: Heroku Pulls Sponsorship After Boston API Jam Publishes Sexist Eventbrite

#40

Post by kellishaver » Tue, Mar 20, 2012, 9:09 PM UTC

vertis wrote: post #11

I'm all for less sexism in the tech community, but this just looks like someone taking an opportunity to make a furor, rather than constructively working to change attitudes. "Let's have a lynching."

As one of those elusive "females in tech" who generally gets somewhat tired of hearing about all of the complaints about sexism in tech, because I think a lot of people are overly sensitive to it, Sqoot's actions were the first thing I've read in a long time that actually offended me.