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Right. That's why I have my 3 year old scheduled for a nose job. I'll probably wait a couple years on the boob job. /s
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The persistent and pervasive impact of bullying in childhood and adolescence
151–160 of 449 posts
Re: The persistent and pervasive impact of bullying in childhood and adolescence
#152Earlier quoted context omitted.
So basically you advocate not only educating the own kid, but also educating their peers to intervene, and also educating the older ones to police the area, and educating the adults in the end. Do you really think this is a realistic policy, over the lifetime of your school kid? In an ideal world, no idea, but in this real world Id say zero chance. However I can tell you how it works around here (Switzerland, by no m…
This was basically how things have worked and continue to work in (particularly rural) areas where policymaking is lacking and people are left to their own devices. "Bullied" kids seek help from their immediate peers, from their/their peers older siblings, and from adults, roughly in that order. Parents typically do not hesitate to suggest aggressive escalation as a conflict resolution strategy. This strategy is ofte…
One notes that rural teens and young adults die of suicide at nearly twice the rate of those in urban areas. (https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jamapediatrics/fullarticle/...)
Re: The persistent and pervasive impact of bullying in childhood and adolescence
#153Earlier quoted context omitted.
My understanding is as follows: 1) If you're roughly evenly matched, you should fight 2) If you're not, your peers should intervene - "pick on someone your own size" 3) If this doesn't work, escalate to older peers 4) If that doesn't work, escalate to adults This relies on children being taught and encouraged to intervene in unfair conflict, which the research indicates they are naturally inclined to do.
There isn’t one of these steps that bullied children are not doing that they could do to resolve their issue. If your point is that their issue could be solved with education; well maybe, maybe they need parenting also…
I think the point is that the education system has to embrace this strategy rather than fight it with zero tolerance policies.
Re: The persistent and pervasive impact of bullying in childhood and adolescence
#154Earlier quoted context omitted.
So basically you advocate not only educating the own kid, but also educating their peers to intervene, and also educating the older ones to police the area, and educating the adults in the end. Do you really think this is a realistic policy, over the lifetime of your school kid? In an ideal world, no idea, but in this real world Id say zero chance. However I can tell you how it works around here (Switzerland, by no m…
This was basically how things have worked and continue to work in (particularly rural) areas where policymaking is lacking and people are left to their own devices. "Bullied" kids seek help from their immediate peers, from their/their peers older siblings, and from adults, roughly in that order. Parents typically do not hesitate to suggest aggressive escalation as a conflict resolution strategy. This strategy is ofte…
"This was basically how things have worked and continue to work in (particularly rural) areas where policymaking is lacking and people are left to their own devices."
So in rural areas if a child in school grabs another child, throws them on the ground, and starts beating them in the middle of math class, the teacher will not attempt to intervene?
Sorry but I don't believe this.
Re: The persistent and pervasive impact of bullying in childhood and adolescence
#155Earlier quoted context omitted.
"Solve the problem yourself". Yeah, you've never had to deal with being chased by bullies and having the shit kicked out of you for no reason. Bullying is not a conflict between peers anymore than a woman getting raped is a conflict between peers. As an adult these problems are solved for you by either human resources, the police, or being able to avoid the situation. Maybe that's why you don't walk around the rough…
Well, bullying is many things, and I think the exact issue is that the conversation lacks nuance. As I mentioned in my first post, conflict which is evenly matched should not be regarded the same way as conflict which is not. If you are attacked by a group of people, or someone substantially larger than you, then intervention is warranted. Ideally this intervention is carried out by older peers. If you're being bulli…
Can you give an example of what being bullied by a peer would look like and what skills would be required to resolve that conflict?
Re: The persistent and pervasive impact of bullying in childhood and adolescence
#156I really wonder how many americans and asians here think, that schools in Europe are inherently less affected by bullying. I went to a public school in germany. I attended school from around 2000s-2010s, so i had a mixed bag young teachers affected by modern pedagogics, middle aged teachers and teachers who clearly showed influence of nazi like pedagogy (it’s called „schwarze pädagogik“ (black pedagogy) in german an was popular until the late 70s.
At least one girl and three boys dropped out of my high school year (we had 3 classes with around 20-30 students) explicitly because they had been bullied! Then there was at least one student, who repeated a year because of bullying. Then there were like two female and male students who got heavily bullied, but made it through high school without disturbances.
Re: The persistent and pervasive impact of bullying in childhood and adolescence
#157Earlier quoted context omitted.
Well, bullying is many things, and I think the exact issue is that the conversation lacks nuance. As I mentioned in my first post, conflict which is evenly matched should not be regarded the same way as conflict which is not. If you are attacked by a group of people, or someone substantially larger than you, then intervention is warranted. Ideally this intervention is carried out by older peers. If you're being bulli…
Can you give an example of what being bullied by a peer would look like and what skills would be required to resolve that conflict?
If one of your classmates takes to pushing you around, taking your stuff, embarrassing you, calling you names, etc. This is normal behaviour in apes who are trying to establish a dominance hierarchy. The bully likely sees you as a soft target who is easy to dominate. The best course is to correct that assumption - escalate conflict - fight back, fight dirty. It's the same rationale as in prison - you don't want to end up at the bottom of the dominance hierarchy. The best way to avoid that is to make friends and be more trouble than you are worth.
Re: The persistent and pervasive impact of bullying in childhood and adolescence
#158Earlier quoted context omitted.
Learning how to respond to antisocial behaviour by a peer, and being able to resolve conflict independently, are two very important skills that it's critical to learn. Being seen as someone who needs adult help to resolve peer conflict is socially disastrous for young people. We do children no favours by intervening in this developmental process.
Problem: " Existing research indicates that (a) being bullied in childhood is associated with distress and symptoms of mental health problems...; (b) the consequences of childhood bullying victimisation can persist up to midlife and, in addition to mental health, can impact physical and socioeconomic outcomes. " Solution: Let 'em work it out themselves.
> Solution: Let 'em work it out themselves.
Working-it-out is an effective approach for two people who want to solve an issue - an issue that they're both fairly responsible for.
But where you have one child experiencing long-term and unearned mistreatment at the hands of many peers - attempts at working-it-out are such a mismatched response that more mistreatment seems likely.
Re: The persistent and pervasive impact of bullying in childhood and adolescence
#159Earlier quoted context omitted.
Not to downplay the severity of the problem in America, but bullying is pretty damn severe in East Asia. The "nail that sticks up gets hammered down" quote often used to describe the situation there. Search "japan bullying" in Youtube and you'll find a long list of videos talking about the issue in Japan in particular.
I know it's not exactly a reliable record, but Japanese high school anime are a popular genre and pretty consistently depict a fairly intense atmosphere of bullying. It's often not the focus so you have to read between the lines a bit in some of them, but it's usually there. Not sure how much of that's true and how much is fictional trope.
I'm not sure what you mean by Japanese high school anime? Some anime, particularly in the slice of life genre, depict a idealized version of high school where there is no bullying.
Re: The persistent and pervasive impact of bullying in childhood and adolescence
#160Many arguments here against bulling prevention seem to conflate two different issues.
They lump squabbles between similarly weighted peers with the situation where individual children get systemically singled out for mistreatment.