Why Finnish babies sleep in cardboard boxes (2013) • Hacker News Board

Re: Why Finnish babies sleep in cardboard boxes (2013)

#151

Post by fsloth » Wed, Dec 22, 2021, 2:42 PM UTC

newjersey wrote: post #127

fsloth wrote: post #113

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For example, Finland has very low amount of capital. GDP is the revenue stream. Amount of capital reflects actual wealth and potential for return of investments.

Comments like this is why people ignore economists when it comes to personal finance. Macroeconomics is so difficult to grasp for me and feels so far away from anything that is remotely related to my life that just talking about it feels silly. The amount of capital in the US or even my state feels like completely divorced from whether I feel comfortable having children and raising a family (I don't at all).

Sure! But when the question is "Is country x rich or poor" it's hard to gauge it any other way than using macroeconomics.

"How would you feel living in country X" and "how does a person in a similiar position as myself feel living in country X" is quite personal question and probably quite detached from macroeconomics unless comparing countries with wildly different GDP:s.

Re: Why Finnish babies sleep in cardboard boxes (2013)

#152

Post by Icathian » Wed, Dec 22, 2021, 2:45 PM UTC

zthrowaway wrote: post #131

InsomniacL wrote: post #117

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Apparently in America it can cost tens of thousands of dollars to give birth in a hospital. Also, 'skin-on-skin' contact after giving birth is a chargeable extra. We don't know how fortunate we are here in the UK with the NHS.

> Also, 'skin-on-skin' contact after giving birth is a chargeable extra. Just had a kid in the US, not true. I’m curious to see where you learned this from, it seems hyperbolic. Also, it cost me $2k after all was said and done.

My kid was born in early 2020, I paid even less and also wasn't charged for holding her. Not sure why you're being downvoted for providing actual facts.

Re: Why Finnish babies sleep in cardboard boxes (2013)

#153

Post by mmarq » Wed, Dec 22, 2021, 2:47 PM UTC

InsomniacL wrote: post #117

leokennis wrote: post #115

On the same subject, I only recently came to know that "Kraamzorg" ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kraamzorg ) is not or hardly offered in other countries. When you become parents (whether that is for the first or the nth time), a specialized nurse will visit your home for 24-80 hours spread over multiple days to help with anything required. If it's your first, she/he will mainly focus on teaching (how to bathe a bab…

Apparently in America it can cost tens of thousands of dollars to give birth in a hospital. Also, 'skin-on-skin' contact after giving birth is a chargeable extra. We don't know how fortunate we are here in the UK with the NHS.

I had a child relatively recently in the UK, and we had to pay for many visits and scans that anywhere else in Europe would have been free. For instance you never see a gynaecologist unless something very very bad is going on. If you want the same level of care you would receive in Italy or Germany, you end up spending 2-3K£.

Probably better than the US, but given the taxes we pay, I’d expect something more. I’d rather pay half the taxes I pay now and spend 10K£ to give birth, than paying 40K£ a year of income tax and get the level of service of a developing country.

Re: Why Finnish babies sleep in cardboard boxes (2013)

#154

Post by cjrp » Wed, Dec 22, 2021, 3:08 PM UTC

leokennis wrote: post #115

On the same subject, I only recently came to know that "Kraamzorg" ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kraamzorg ) is not or hardly offered in other countries. When you become parents (whether that is for the first or the nth time), a specialized nurse will visit your home for 24-80 hours spread over multiple days to help with anything required. If it's your first, she/he will mainly focus on teaching (how to bathe a bab…

Sounds sort of similar to a doula here in the UK, but they're not very common in my experience.

Re: Why Finnish babies sleep in cardboard boxes (2013)

#155

Post by mikewarot » Wed, Dec 22, 2021, 3:15 PM UTC

divbzero wrote: post #99

mikewarot wrote: post #94

Here in the US we had a special high strength box that allowed our child to sleep between us when warranted, it was strong enough to keep us from rolling over accidents.

Was this special box something you purchased or something you put together yourself?

It was over a decade ago, and google fails me. Sorry.

Re: Why Finnish babies sleep in cardboard boxes (2013)

#156

Post by Notanothertoo » Wed, Dec 22, 2021, 3:37 PM UTC

noodlesUK wrote: post #137

leokennis wrote: post #115

On the same subject, I only recently came to know that "Kraamzorg" ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kraamzorg ) is not or hardly offered in other countries. When you become parents (whether that is for the first or the nth time), a specialized nurse will visit your home for 24-80 hours spread over multiple days to help with anything required. If it's your first, she/he will mainly focus on teaching (how to bathe a bab…

I would not exist if my mother had been in the US or another location with private healthcare when she was pregnant with me. She had a tough pregnancy and had to take a significant amount of time off work and was on bedrest for approximately 3 months. During those ~3 months, she had a medical professional come to her home every day (her midwife and doctor alternated days). This would simply not be possible if healthc…

This is not entirely unique situation. There is insurance for all of the above. It's just not everyone has access to it, but I'd wager if you don't then you like shouldn't be having kids.

Re: Why Finnish babies sleep in cardboard boxes (2013)

#157

Post by masklinn » Wed, Dec 22, 2021, 5:11 PM UTC

Hamuko wrote: post #87

masklinn wrote: post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Sure, it's mostly symbolic Is it? The maternity box is worth a lot, and that the box itself doubles up as a crib (by design) seems like a huge convenience.

FWIW, you can actually choose a cash payment (170 euro) instead of receiving the maternity package, but 95% of first-time mothers choose the maternity package and two thirds of all mothers.

You can choose a cash payment but the box is worth significantly more, something like double, plus the peace of mind that you should have most of what you need as you learn to care for your first.

Re: Why Finnish babies sleep in cardboard boxes (2013)

#158

Post by fastasucan » Wed, Dec 22, 2021, 5:24 PM UTC

zthrowaway wrote: post #131

InsomniacL wrote: post #117

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Apparently in America it can cost tens of thousands of dollars to give birth in a hospital. Also, 'skin-on-skin' contact after giving birth is a chargeable extra. We don't know how fortunate we are here in the UK with the NHS.

> Also, 'skin-on-skin' contact after giving birth is a chargeable extra. Just had a kid in the US, not true. I’m curious to see where you learned this from, it seems hyperbolic. Also, it cost me $2k after all was said and done.

I cant imagine having to pay that much. Wow.

Re: Why Finnish babies sleep in cardboard boxes (2013)

#159

Post by sgerenser » Wed, Dec 22, 2021, 6:01 PM UTC

stevehawk wrote: post #138

divbzero wrote: post #105

Finnbin [1] is a company that sold Finnish style baby boxes in the US up until July 2021. Oddly enough, they appear to have suspended operations due to a US Consumer Product Safety Commission ruling that effectively bans baby boxes. [1]: https://www.finnbin.com/ [2]: https://www.finnbin.com/blogs/news/finnbin-suspends-operatio...

It appears that the CPSC in the US has decided that it's safer for babies to sleep in objects that can be tipped over (must have legs) than in a box on the ground.

I’m sure the issue is actually that most people don’t want it on the ground, they want it up higher where it’s easier to see, change, and interact with the baby. So people were probably placing the box onto tables, shelves, etc. where the risk of it falling off were deemed too high.

Re: Why Finnish babies sleep in cardboard boxes (2013)

#160

Post by palijer » Wed, Dec 22, 2021, 6:54 PM UTC

zthrowaway wrote: post #131

InsomniacL wrote: post #117

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Apparently in America it can cost tens of thousands of dollars to give birth in a hospital. Also, 'skin-on-skin' contact after giving birth is a chargeable extra. We don't know how fortunate we are here in the UK with the NHS.

> Also, 'skin-on-skin' contact after giving birth is a chargeable extra. Just had a kid in the US, not true. I’m curious to see where you learned this from, it seems hyperbolic. Also, it cost me $2k after all was said and done.

Cost my friends who didn't have personal health insurance $5 because they paid for parking. Live in Canada though, $2k seems insane with all the other expenses of a new baby and starting a family.