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Docker Raises $23M

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Re: Docker Raises $23M

#151

I just wish Windows has built-in Docker so that i don't need to install anything like wsl,... Make docker run on bare-metal Windows is a huge improvement to my life ! Why? WSL or VM is stupid because it costs around 5-6GB of RAM without doing anything.

Just install WSL standalone edition. It runs on bare metal with no virtualization. Also GUI is much better and no tracking!

Re: Docker Raises $23M

#152

I just wish Windows has built-in Docker so that i don't need to install anything like wsl,... Make docker run on bare-metal Windows is a huge improvement to my life ! Why? WSL or VM is stupid because it costs around 5-6GB of RAM without doing anything.

Well, Docker is a Linux technology. If you really need Docker that badly and can't take the overhead of a VM, then it sounds like you would be better off just running Linux like the rest of us. :)

Re: Docker Raises $23M

#153

It feels like Docker (Inc) is becoming less and less "relevant" for each year that passes. At least from my perspective, they led the popularisation of containerisation and the whole cattle-not-pets approach of deploying apps. They created big and long lasting change in the industry. But they seem to have lost the production environment race to Kubernetes, at least for now. They are the biggest player in the dev-mach…

Kubernetes is so much more than most people should want or need. It's far too complicated and heavyweight for smaller or simpler deployments. In AWS, most people should use ECS/Fargate instead. There are other competing container environments as well. Your point still stands; Docker popularized containerization and are in danger of becoming irrelevant because they ceded the container execution environment to others.

I don't know about "ceded". The container execution environment wasn't a very defensible position. People recognized very quickly that Docker's execution environment was a very thin layer over existing Linux kernel functionality. At my company in 2013, we launched our own internal container containerization about the same time Docker came out, based on LXC.

That said, I agree about a higher level PaaS-style offering being a better fit for most companies.

Re: Docker Raises $23M

#154
post #83

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Now there's something called Swarm mode built directly into the main Docker engine. I think that was the "replacement" of the classic Docker Swarm.

So, who owns the "Docker Engine" ? Mirantis or Docker Inc?

Mirantis

Re: Docker Raises $23M

#155
post #4

Interesting to see this called a Series B. Did Docker hit reset after the split? Here's a separate thread for "Docker Series B: More Fuel To Help Dev Teams Get Ship Done" - with a bit more info on what the plan is from Scott. Interesting to see this news on the same day that "We don't need Docker" was also on the front page of Hacker News. I think we absolutely still need Docker in 2021. https://news.ycombinator.com/…

> "We don't need Docker" was also on the front page of Hacker News. I read it as a typical "We don't need [Complex Tool] because we don't have [Complex Tool Solutions] problems". Not trivializing it, I think those articles are valuable hype-free analysis of the latest tool-of-the-day. "They don't need Docker" and "We absolutely need Docker" are non-contradictory.

Yesterday was in a meeting discussing our build pipeline and we had this moment of introspection where we realized "wow, we do a completely containerized, micro-serviced app and it actually works really well for the most part". When Docker was very new I remember dealing with all manner of bizarre issues, mostly because the engineers just weren't used to how to use it yet. But if you have some decent idea of how to architect it then Docker is a huge boon IMO.

People are also totally right to question why some new fancy tool is needed when the old way works. Its best to just view all these things as tools at your disposal rather than necessities.

Re: Docker Raises $23M

#156

I just wish Windows has built-in Docker so that i don't need to install anything like wsl,... Make docker run on bare-metal Windows is a huge improvement to my life ! Why? WSL or VM is stupid because it costs around 5-6GB of RAM without doing anything.

Well, Docker is a Linux technology. If you really need Docker that badly and can't take the overhead of a VM, then it sounds like you would be better off just running Linux like the rest of us. :)

Aha, i think so.

But i need to spend some times with Windows softwares, too ;)

Re: Docker Raises $23M

#157
post #147

I really see this as trying to buy enough time for someone to rescue the investors, maybe the founders and definitely not the employees with an acquihire. Docker is a good example of a company that (IMHO) should never have raised so much capital. It just doesn't have the moat to justify the valuation. HN has posted several submissions (eg [1]). Containers aren't new. Anyone can do it. So where is the moat? Possibilit…

While I am normally critical of the unicorn pizza-kitchen-on-wheels type of excess, I think this is only true in hindsight and has a lot to do with Docker lacking a commercially minded founder. Open source isn’t a business model. There are very synergistic business models that go hand in hand with OSS but that distinction is important. Github does not really have a defensible moat. I think the network effects there are mostly trying to back-solve for its popularity. But it’s just a good product that became synonymous with modern version control. Docker had similar potential, but needed more commercial creativity.

Re: Docker Raises $23M

#158

I just wish Windows has built-in Docker so that i don't need to install anything like wsl,... Make docker run on bare-metal Windows is a huge improvement to my life ! Why? WSL or VM is stupid because it costs around 5-6GB of RAM without doing anything.

Just install WSL standalone edition. It runs on bare metal with no virtualization. Also GUI is much better and no tracking!

Thanks for the info. Could you give me more info on the link ?

As i tried, wsl need a VM to run.

Re: Docker Raises $23M

#159
post #111

It feels like Docker (Inc) is becoming less and less "relevant" for each year that passes. At least from my perspective, they led the popularisation of containerisation and the whole cattle-not-pets approach of deploying apps. They created big and long lasting change in the industry. But they seem to have lost the production environment race to Kubernetes, at least for now. They are the biggest player in the dev-mach…

I was already doing containers with HP-UX Vaults in version 11 back in 1999. Just like any tool that doesn't offer more than an abstraction layer over OS features, eventually it becomes irrelevant as OS tooling improves.

> Just like any tool that doesn't offer more than an abstraction layer over OS features, eventually it becomes irrelevant as OS tooling improves

You'd think. But I think what we're seeing here is the opposite side of the coin flip of that thread that smug idiots like to continually link here where people were saying Dropbox could be implemented in a day using basic Linux tools. Those people in the thread were always correct (I mean, this is "Hacker" news, so people will approach every problem with their hammer... shocking).

Dropbox just happened to get lucky. Docker, not so much. Both have serious competitors, including Google.

Re: Docker Raises $23M

#160
post #124

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is kind of reductive. You could ask the same for nomad, mesos, and lots of other things. It wasn't just swarm vs k8s

How is it reductive? I do ask the same question for all those other systems, or the meta-question: "How is it that the bloated monstrosity of Kubernetes somehow became the de-facto container orchestration tool?" Is this just sysadmins buying themselves job security?

As someone who doesn't want to be a sysadmin, but wants to deploy applications to the cloud, the options are fairly limited. Kubernetes handles updates and scaling, networking between services, has managed offerings from all the major cloud providers, has an enormous ecosystem surrounding it, with many tools providing out of the box support for it.

I could use docker swarm, or nomad, but I have to manage infrastructure, write my own integrations, manage the underlying hardware.

Or I can run az aks create and be off to the races

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