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Amazon Quits China Market

pandaily.com

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Re: Amazon Quits China Market

#151

Post by robryan »

A2017U1 wrote: post #76
product50 wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Dude do some research. They are winning or close to winning in India, South East Asia, Western Europe, Australia, US, Dubai etc.

> Australia Absolutely disagree, their service is shockingly slow and the limited range is overpriced. They make up about 0.4% of Australian online sales. I'm not sure where you got this impression from.

Eventually they will probably have distribution centers in each capital city. Delivery in Melbourne is pretty fast, depending a bit which courier they use. A lot of their orders seem to come via Toll which seems to vary a bit in speed.

Re: Amazon Quits China Market

#152

Post by AsyncAwait »

manigandham wrote: post #130
tanilama wrote: post #127

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Amazon isn't near top ever in China, it is like 1-2 percent of the market share. Not that different than Microsoft sunset their gaming business in Japan

Amazon will never get greater market share because China's govt won't let them. Microsoft did not leave Japan, they are in fact expanding Xbox Asia and have added an Asian team to the Global Gaming Partnership and Development (GDDP) division: https://www.google.com/search?q=xbox+asia+expanding

It seems to me that in these kinds of topics, someone always tries to pin the majority of the blame on Chinese protectionism. While that's certainly a factor, it seems Amazon has not been able to capture anywhere near the market share foreign companies operating in China are regularly allowed to capture, (before feeling the pressure).

So sometimes, (like in this case, it looks like), it may just really be the case of a business not being able to adopt to the different expectations of Chinese consumers.

I was just reading the other day about why U.S. car makers struggle in Japan and that for example domestic car makers there offer the ability to customize the car to an extent U.S. companies can't compete with.

It's likely that Amazon faced enough competition naturally, given its low market share.

Re: Amazon Quits China Market

#153

Post by hartator »

munk-a wrote: post #143
xvector wrote: post #140

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> there are major product differences between Amazon and its Chinese competitors, Because the Chinese counterparts are government propped.

Honestly, what? The US props up US corporations all the time... didn't Amazon just pay -$129M (as in, received free money) in taxes to the US government?

Assuming an average 8.00% sales tax on Amazon revenue 232.9 billion USD, Amazon still paid $18-19B in taxes. That's significant. And EU VATs are usually higher than 8.00%.

Re: Amazon Quits China Market

#154

Post by chillacy »

product50 wrote: post #32

Amazon has literally won everywhere else in the world. But in China they were slow at execution? Does this read right to you? Or maybe there is a regulatory angle which no one is talking about because...China.

Ebay has been a lot more dominant relative to Amazon for awhile in UK, FR, DE, AU

Re: Amazon Quits China Market

#155

Post by tracker1 »

manigandham wrote: post #130
tanilama wrote: post #127

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Amazon isn't near top ever in China, it is like 1-2 percent of the market share. Not that different than Microsoft sunset their gaming business in Japan

Amazon will never get greater market share because China's govt won't let them. Microsoft did not leave Japan, they are in fact expanding Xbox Asia and have added an Asian team to the Global Gaming Partnership and Development (GDDP) division: https://www.google.com/search?q=xbox+asia+expanding

I think part of the problem a lot of the time, is Asia gets bundled together... I mean Indian culture by itself is varied, let alone Japan, Taiwan, Singapore, China and other Asian countries. Much more so than even intra-US variances between D and R. You need businesses that understand this, or need to stay in more localized regions and expand as one's understanding expands.

Culture is varied and in many ways everything. Competition is also biased and fierce. At least that's my understanding of things (as a white guy born and remaining in the SW USA).

I do find it funny that Amazon is pivoting to "high quality cross-border sales" considering that into the U.S. seems to be low quality, high markup sales (including high levels of counterfeits) with no end in sight.

Re: Amazon Quits China Market

#156

Post by 1986 »

hartator wrote: post #153
munk-a wrote: post #143

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Honestly, what? The US props up US corporations all the time... didn't Amazon just pay -$129M (as in, received free money) in taxes to the US government?

Assuming an average 8.00% sales tax on Amazon revenue 232.9 billion USD, Amazon still paid $18-19B in taxes. That's significant. And EU VATs are usually higher than 8.00%.

Amazon didn't pay those taxes, purchasers did.

Re: Amazon Quits China Market

#157

Post by manigandham »

munk-a wrote: post #143
xvector wrote: post #140

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> there are major product differences between Amazon and its Chinese competitors, Because the Chinese counterparts are government propped.

Honestly, what? The US props up US corporations all the time... didn't Amazon just pay -$129M (as in, received free money) in taxes to the US government?

Any corporation here can take advantage of tax rules. You can be a Chinese national starting a US company as a subsidiary of a Chinese company and do exactly the same thing.

Re: Amazon Quits China Market

#158

Post by hartator »

1986 wrote: post #156
hartator wrote: post #153

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Assuming an average 8.00% sales tax on Amazon revenue 232.9 billion USD, Amazon still paid $18-19B in taxes. That's significant. And EU VATs are usually higher than 8.00%.

Amazon didn't pay those taxes, purchasers did.

In theory. Also, purchasers can be seen as paying profit taxes as well.

Re: Amazon Quits China Market

#159

Post by seemuch »

I am so sad to see how the comments under this post manifest. People just blindly pointing fingers to the big evil Chinese government for the failure, without any evidence whatsoever. I get it, failures are hard. But you can face it and learn to be responsible for it. All grownups do that. I think American are transitioning from a bunch of doers to a bunch of whiners.

Re: Amazon Quits China Market

#160

Post by tracker1 »

PakG1 wrote: post #92
adinobro wrote: post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

JD and TMall have about close to 1,000 distribution points in the major cities with at least 10,000 delivery people each. Same day delivery is standard (order before 10am and it arrives by 6pm) for a lot of products. Install and building furniture at your home is also a common feature. Two day delivery is slow. Amazon isn't willing to invest the money and for most products on their site they still don't stock product…

I don't think it's logical for them to have local stock. That would require a HUGE capital investment to build up infrastructure and distribution points to go head to head with the locals. I bet Amazon's CFO looks at that and then tells Bezos, "Hey, these numbers are completely irrational, let's spend the money elsewhere where we'll have a better return on investment, please."

Amazon is used to building out localized infrastructure AFTER demand has been proven. In China, local competition already exists and that's why they are getting their asses handed to them. It also seems like Amazon.cn isn't given the leeway they should have been given for local execs to make those kinds of calls. They (Amazon) do a lot right, but that doesn't mean their approach is always right.
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