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Senators Kerry & Lugar Introduce the Startup Visa Act

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Re: Senators Kerry & Lugar Introduce the Startup Visa Act

#151

Post by btilly »

nzmsv wrote: post #145
potatolicious wrote: post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Speaking as a Canadian who immigrated from Asia, and know a large number of rich Asians who have also followed the same path, the situation is really not as simple as you put it. The rich are in no way obligated to share their wealth with you - as the Canadian government has unfortunately learned. Our immigration programs have three paths: skilled labour, investment, and entrepreneurial. Skilled labour is simply lett…

Many countries, Canada included, have bilateral agreements on only taxing income once. So, if these people you know make money off foreign property, they pay taxes on it in the country where it is located. They do not have to pay taxes again in Canada. Which I think is fair: would you want to pay double taxes on your income?

Double check the relevant treaties. They are often written to say that where double taxation exists, the secondary country may collect their usual tax minus what was paid to the primary. Therefore if the secondary country has a higher tax rate, there is an incentive to keep it off the books.

That said, Canadian law tends to tax people on Canadian earnings. (Or at least it did the last time I paid attention, which was admittedly 15 years ago or so.) Which contrasts to US law that taxes US citizens on worldwide earnings (though the US does give a large exemption for foreign sourced income that keeps this from affecting a lot of people).

Re: Senators Kerry & Lugar Introduce the Startup Visa Act

#152

Post by dtby »

fnid2 wrote: post #136
lionhearted wrote: post #125

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> If you believe in Greatest Good for the Greatest Number anyway, but not all subscribe to that philosophy. I do I think. This is a bit tangential, but I think it's quite important - Greatest Good is a very important belief for someone to consider, and you've written really thoughtfully and introspectively. Here's my perspective, which is a little different: Sometimes I voluntarily do things to make other people happ…

I'm not suggesting we take the $10,000 from a rich person and give it to 10 poor people, rather I'm saying, "We have a surplus of wealth equal to $10,000 and must decide what to do with it. Someone is going to benefit, how do we distribute the surplus such that it creates the most good? I would suggest distributing the wealth equally among all is the best route to the greatest happiness, rather than giving most or al…

Whence comes this wealth? Government is not a wealth-creating enterprise. It's (arguably, entirely; verifiably, primarily) in the wealth redistribution business.

Re: Senators Kerry & Lugar Introduce the Startup Visa Act

#153

Post by ojbyrne »

adw wrote: post #108
pg wrote: post #64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's such a dishonest way of describing the situation that it's hard to believe it wasn't deliberate. You describe this bill as if it merely allowed powerful people to get their friends into the country, and it's not like that at all. Startup investors are not identical with the rich and connected. Angel investors are generally fairly rich, but not all VCs are. And they're not choosing people at random to bring int…

To be fair, you can turn that round; my reading of what Brian said was that he thought this bill was open to abuse, which could make your reading seem disingenuous. Neither interpretation's fair to either of you, though. (I have no horse in this race; living in Europe, the idea of a visa seems a bit anachronistic, really.)

As other people have commented, when you say "anachronistic" you really are being chauvinistic. I.e. you're assuming that there's no such thing as non-EU citizens who actually want to work in Europe. Those people face similar hurdles to those wanting to work in the US.

Re: Senators Kerry & Lugar Introduce the Startup Visa Act

#154

Post by dgallagher »

briansmith wrote: post #26

This would just allow the rich and connected to choose thousands of people to budge to the front of a 3-5 year long line that other green gard applicants (EB-3) are waiting in. If there are resources available to process more EB-5's and EB-6's, then put them to use accelerating the process for the people that have already waited years for their applications to be approved. Accelerate that process and you'll accelerat…

According to the letter submitted by Senators Kerry and Lugar, it would only affect resources for EB-5 visas (no mention of EB-3 visas):

To make visas available, we would amend immigration law to create a new EB-6 category for immigrant entrepreneurs. We would draw from existing visas under the EB-5 category. The EB-5 permits foreign nationals who invest at least $1 million in the U.S., and thereby create 10 jobs, to obtain a green card. In areas where unemployment is high, foreign nationals need only invest $500,000 to obtain residency. Though roughly 10,000 visas are annually allocated for the EB-5 category, less than half were used in FY 2009, so the addition of immigrant entrepreneurs should not present an unreasonable burden.

http://startupvisa.files.wordpress.com/2010/02/dc-startup-vi...

This merely branches a new visa off from EB-5, which is separate from, and has different intentions than, EB-3. EB-5 visas are not all being used up anymore, so both Senators are attempting to put those waisted EB-5's to good use. They imply that the proposed EB-6 visas "should not present an unreasonable burden" on the system.

Re: Senators Kerry & Lugar Introduce the Startup Visa Act

#155

Post by eagleal »

henrikschroder wrote: post #135
blackguardx wrote: post #127

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I currently live in the US. Can I just move to Europe and get a job? Or, do I have to do some sort of paperwork first (like get a visa)?

If you are not a EU citizen you need a residence permit and a work permit. I don't know how different the rules are between the EU countries, but it's roughly the same everwhere. A work permit is typically tied to an employer, and a residence permit is typically tied to a work permit. Here's the different kinds for Sweden: http://www.migrationsverket.se/info/1074_en.html

Once you have a Visa/Residence permit (work) in one country you can freely move between all the EU countries. (I live in Italy with residence permit, so I know)

Re: Senators Kerry & Lugar Introduce the Startup Visa Act

#156

Post by cuttinedg »

Every initiative can be used wisely or misused. Understanding atoms led to Hiroshima as well as clean fuel.

I am a US resident based out of India and mentor a few students. I do talk a lot of PG and recently one of my students asked me as to why YCombinator would not come down to India to organize a camp and find worthy ideas deserving funding. These are students who, in the current scenario, need to first head over to US on a student or work visa, and then apply for YC funding. By the time they do that, most of them would have missed out a few precious years from the age PG writes about as the golden age for taking risks (and I agree).

This visa opens up those doors. Yes, it can be misused, but if a little use comes out of it and benefit the world, that is good enough.

US is losing out to India and China with respect to having a whole new generation being highly educated. This visa is a great measure to continue to attract talent from world over.

Re: Senators Kerry & Lugar Introduce the Startup Visa Act

#157

Post by fnid2 »

dtby wrote: post #152
fnid2 wrote: post #136

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not suggesting we take the $10,000 from a rich person and give it to 10 poor people, rather I'm saying, "We have a surplus of wealth equal to $10,000 and must decide what to do with it. Someone is going to benefit, how do we distribute the surplus such that it creates the most good? I would suggest distributing the wealth equally among all is the best route to the greatest happiness, rather than giving most or al…

Whence comes this wealth? Government is not a wealth-creating enterprise. It's (arguably, entirely; verifiably, primarily) in the wealth redistribution business.

The wealth comes from within the borders of a given country. Government might not be in the business of creating wealth, but it is in the business of controlling who gets to be within its geographical borders.

If you look throughout history, it's never really worked out well to allow a rich minority to determine what happens to people and the land. Since time immemorial, a rich few have been abusing the property rights of others. Even America was founded by a rich minority who took the wealth of the land from the majority incumbents.

It's the same thing as always.

Re: Senators Kerry & Lugar Introduce the Startup Visa Act

#158

Post by winter_blue »

I'm really impressed at how quickly the US government responds to the demands of its citizens. (in this instance, a demand for a startup visa.) US is an example of true democracy.

In countries like India, it can take several years to get simple demands of the people into law. Most politicians there are incredibly self-interested and care little about the people. (I'm not saying US politicians are not self-interested, but at least they listen to their people.

If only the governments of India and other countries in similar situations began listening to their people's demands.. then these countries would be so much better off.

Re: Senators Kerry & Lugar Introduce the Startup Visa Act

#159

Post by dtby »

fnid2 wrote: post #157
dtby wrote: post #152

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Whence comes this wealth? Government is not a wealth-creating enterprise. It's (arguably, entirely; verifiably, primarily) in the wealth redistribution business.

The wealth comes from within the borders of a given country. Government might not be in the business of creating wealth, but it is in the business of controlling who gets to be within its geographical borders. If you look throughout history, it's never really worked out well to allow a rich minority to determine what happens to people and the land. Since time immemorial, a rich few have been abusing the property righ…

Without arguing the points above one way or another:

Unless I misread your initial message, you suggested that the government was not "taking" wealth from anyone, but rather it somehow had "surplus" wealth to be distributed. My question is more finely tuned to "where did this 'surplus' wealth come from, if it was not 'taken' from someone at some point?"

Re: Senators Kerry & Lugar Introduce the Startup Visa Act

#160

Post by neilc »

tptacek wrote: post #2

This is a bill that proposes to give US venture capitalists the overt ability to terminate the residency status of founders and their families. Not only do you have to get sponsored by an effectively arbitrary class of financiers (it is possible that Warren Buffet wouldn't qualify under these terms, depending on whether he has personally made 2 equity investments last year), but even if your company creates 10 US job…

This is a bill that proposes to give US venture capitalists the overt ability to terminate the residency status of founders and their families.

US employers already have this power over employees that hold visas. Why do you trust employers but not VCs? (Or put another one, there is potential for abuse in either arrangement, but I'm not convinced that VCs are fundamentally worse than employers.)

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