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Americans abroad are giving up their citizenship as banks shut down accounts

theguardian.com

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Re: Americans abroad are giving up their citizenship as banks shut down accounts

#141

Post by walshemj »

MCRed wrote: post #79
chaziaik wrote: post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Do you have more information on this ? If I understood you correctly this would have severe repercussions for foreign investors. Suppose you are a foreign investor, what can you do to protect yourself ?

You don't do business with the USA. And increasingly, that's what they are doing. It's a small effect now since these are relatively new laws, but they are growing every year, and their impact will ramp up exponentially.

yep and in the Uk working in the Uk most banks refuse to do business with you - so no tax free ISA for you Buddy.

It's extremely unfair to US Expats.

Re: Americans abroad are giving up their citizenship as banks shut down accounts

#142

Post by tokenadult »

phunge wrote: post #65

I was personally bit by this (FBAR non-compliance). I worked abroad and was unknowingly violating it; found out about it from reading the news and hired a pro to extricate myself from the situation. The bank account held five figures. The cost to come into compliance was low five figures. The potential penalties were easily high six figures. It was much larger than the either (a) my total earnings from 4 years abroad…

How could you not have known about this? I knew about this before I went abroad, soon after I graduated from university, and I'm not a sophisticated person about most tax issues.

Re: Americans abroad are giving up their citizenship as banks shut down accounts

#143

Post by qdog »

waqf wrote: post #111
sliverstorm wrote: post #94

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why is it absurd? Or, from the other angle, why does it exist? (real answers please, not "becuz money-grubbing gub'mint") Considering you get to deduct $100k of your foreign earnings, it's not like they are trying to rake John Doe Expat over the coals.

You mean to imply that being double-taxed after your first $100k is fair and reasonable?

Are you double taxed? Many countries have reciprocal taxing agreements with the U.S. whereby you get credits for foreign taxes. That's how it worked when I was a U.S. citizen in Canada.

Re: Americans abroad are giving up their citizenship as banks shut down accounts

#144

Post by clamprecht »

tptacek wrote: post #70
toomuchtodo wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can I still maintain my US citizenship as an Uruguayan citizen if I so choose?

Doesn't the U.S. have a problem with citizens voluntarily and deliberately acquiring citizenship from foreign countries?

Here's a pretty good dual citizenship FAQ compiled over the years by Rich Wales:

http://www.richw.org/dualcit/ - start here

http://www.richw.org/dualcit/faq.html - the meat of it is here

Re: Americans abroad are giving up their citizenship as banks shut down accounts

#145

Post by cruisername »

sliverstorm wrote: post #112
waqf wrote: post #111

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You mean to imply that being double-taxed after your first $100k is fair and reasonable?

If you own two houses, just because you aren't living at House A right now doesn't mean you don't need to pay upkeep, and doesn't mean you aren't deriving benefit from it. Thought of differently- expats expect to be able to vote, right? Is it fair and reasonable for someone who is categorically excluded from paying taxes, to be allowed to vote?

This implies taxes are fair, that paying taxes is a requirement for voting, like buying your voice, and that voting would give any benefits in return. Yes, of course it is fair to vote when the vote could indirectly decide laws that make you a criminal in some way or another and no, it is not fair to be taxed, especially if you don't use the majority of infrastructure that taxes are supposedly needed for.

I get where you are coming from, sure there are arguments for it, but it's not like there are none against it, either.

Re: Americans abroad are giving up their citizenship as banks shut down accounts

#146

Post by digikata »

cujo wrote: post #136
digikata wrote: post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For one, Americans living abroad and establishing business relationships seems like it would be a component in increasing exports from America, reducing the trade deficit.

Perhaps. But I'm not convinced this new law would have any effect on the scenario you describe. Money is getting pretty good at crossing borders, and the people this mostly effects are not those in the position to put a dent in the trade deficit.

The individuals could be working for large multi-national corporations and still be employees affected by this problem. It's not a sole deciding factor, but if it just adds a little friction in some business options (e.g. hey, who do we have whose willing to go overseas for a year and setup our foreign office) vs others, then it can still affect the needle.

Re: Americans abroad are giving up their citizenship as banks shut down accounts

#147

Post by dreamweapon »

ggambetta wrote: post #115
dreamweapon wrote: post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I wouldn't recommend living in Uruguay; I had very good reasons to leave and I don't see myself returning anytime soon. I'd be curious to know why this is the case for you.

Insecurity, basically. At some point during the last decade society kind of broke down, and the respect for human life was lost. I'm talking 12 year olds killing a store clerk in cold blood for 2 or 3 dollars, or worse [1]. This didn't happen just once; at some point there was a murder per day, in a country of three million people. The government, who are former terrorists [2] and based their campaigns on condemning…

Thanks. Even so, I've always wanted to go there, for some reason. We'll see what happens.

Re: Americans abroad are giving up their citizenship as banks shut down accounts

#148

Post by ggambetta »

dreamweapon wrote: post #147
ggambetta wrote: post #115

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Insecurity, basically. At some point during the last decade society kind of broke down, and the respect for human life was lost. I'm talking 12 year olds killing a store clerk in cold blood for 2 or 3 dollars, or worse [1]. This didn't happen just once; at some point there was a murder per day, in a country of three million people. The government, who are former terrorists [2] and based their campaigns on condemning…

Thanks. Even so, I've always wanted to go there, for some reason. We'll see what happens.

For some tourism, sure, go for it! Summer is best, besides Montevideo you should check out Punta del Este and Colonia.

Re: Americans abroad are giving up their citizenship as banks shut down accounts

#149

Post by jacalata »

Someone1234 wrote: post #126
desdiv wrote: post #125

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The right to return to the US and live there permanently, for one.

But US citizens living abroad have to file tax returns even when they don't exercise that right. They could live abroad for the remainder of their life and have to file (under IRS rules). That seems like a very flimsy argument for why US nationals abroad have to file tax returns.

You didn't specify "what rights do they exercise", just what rights do they have.

Re: Americans abroad are giving up their citizenship as banks shut down accounts

#150

Post by cylinder »

turnip1979 wrote: post #36
philiphodgen wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As a permanent resident, you have a "do or die" date in your life. If you have the green card "in" at least 8 of the last 15 years, you have the privilege of paying the exit tax when you give up the visa status. (Well, you pay extra tax only if you are "rich" for certain definitions of "rich". You will certainly have a giant mountain of tax forms to fill in.) If you terminate your green card before that magic moment…

Can you explain the exit tax thing or give pointers? Does it apply to people on visa's like TN or H1B?

No those are nonimmigrant visas.
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