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Tesla Is Sitting on a Record 50k Unsold EVs

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Re: Tesla Is Sitting on a Record 50k Unsold EVs

#141

Post by tim333 »

freedomben wrote: post #47
jm4 wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What changed is he took the mask off. He was always the sleaze that he is today, but a lot of us were fooled into believing he wanted to do something good.

I don't agree after reading Walter Isaacson's excellent biography of Elon. It's deeply unfortunate that the book is already a few years old, I'd love and buy the hell out of a 2nd edition that is updated with the last few years. Obviously it's always been latent in Elon, but he was a pretty bog standard lightly-if-apolitical silicon valley startup guy for most of his adult life. The free speech erosion under the Bide…

Googling a little, he was a dem:

>Having reportedly voted for Joe Biden in 2020, Musk even voiced his pro-Dems alignment in 2022 when he posted on X, formerly Twitter, that he had “strongly supported Obama for President” in 2007.

I think he turned after Tesla was snubbed at Biden's 2021 EV summit because although it was the US's largest EV maker it wasn't unionized and Biden was in with the unions.

I can sort of see that being annoying.

Re: Tesla Is Sitting on a Record 50k Unsold EVs

#142

Post by tzs »

rvnx wrote: post #69
stingraycharles wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think the vast majority of people that operate at that level of success have a similar mask, but they’re more successful in managing it. What caused Elon to lose his ability to manage it is subject for debate, I personally believe he discovered drugs in 2019 and the rest is history.

He brought good things due to high-conviction bold moves though, like democratizing EVs, reusable rockets, and most of all, actual internet in airplanes.

Is it accurate to say Tesla democratized EVs? The Roadster came out in 2008 but was over $100k. Over its lifetime they only sold around 2500. It was always a rich person's car.

The first 21st century EV in the US that was aimed at a more mainstream mass market was the Nissan Leaf which launched in late 2010, and in the first year sold 4x as many units Tesla Roadster's lifetime sales.

Tesla took a significant step toward an EV for the less rich with the Model S in 2012. It was still a lot more expensive than a Leaf (about 80%ish more for a base Model S) but way less than the Roadster.

The Leaf was the world's best selling EV in 2011-2014 and 2016, and in 2020 was the first to reach 500k sales.

It wasn't until 2017 with the model 3 that Tesla had a car that, like the Leaf, was priced in the range typical middle class families could afford. That's when they took off, and they caught up and passed Leaf in cumulative sales in early 2021.

Re: Tesla Is Sitting on a Record 50k Unsold EVs

#143

Post by bdangubic »

rvnx wrote: post #69
stingraycharles wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think the vast majority of people that operate at that level of success have a similar mask, but they’re more successful in managing it. What caused Elon to lose his ability to manage it is subject for debate, I personally believe he discovered drugs in 2019 and the rest is history.

He brought good things due to high-conviction bold moves though, like democratizing EVs, reusable rockets, and most of all, actual internet in airplanes.

- he most certainly did not democratize EVs, although he said the plan all along was to make cheap EVs it wasn’t until other car companies started “democratizing” EVs that his had was forced (and delayed)

- we had internet (and still do) in planes that have nothing to do with starlink

Re: Tesla Is Sitting on a Record 50k Unsold EVs

#144

Post by tzs »

RickJWagner wrote: post #129
ndsipa_pomu wrote: post #100

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Two very public Nazi salutes without any attempt to deny it afterwards will certainly crater anyone's reputation. It's not really politics, but more a question of humanity, but then people don't become billionaires without having a contempt for others and a desire to underpay and mistreat everyone you come into contact with.

[flagged]

Musk's gestures: https://x.com/BartoSitek/status/1882081868423860315?t=8F0hL-...

Those other people's gestures: https://x.com/ExposingNV/status/1881647306724049116?t=CGKtg0...

Notice anything different?

Re: Tesla Is Sitting on a Record 50k Unsold EVs

#145

Post by tzs »

whizzter wrote: post #85
amelius wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No. For all practical purposes, Chinese cars are perfectly fine for most consumers. Since you cannot beat China on manufacturing costs, this war is already lost. Musk or no Musk.

Chineese phonemakers exist yet Apple pulls in a significant portion of profits due to their _halo_ allowing them to sell at a higher price point. Tesla had that, all Musk had to do was refrain himself from waving his hand around in that certain fashion. New registrations in Sweden for the past 3 years, Sweden alone would've probably absorbed about 14000 cars of that unsold stock. 2023 20388 341835 0,0596428101276932…

> Tesla had that, all Musk had to do was refrain himself from waving his hand around in that certain fashion.

He probably also would have had to refrain from retweeting white nationalists and adding the 100 points emoji that is usually used in that context to mean "100% agreement with the tweet".

Re: Tesla Is Sitting on a Record 50k Unsold EVs

#146

Post by comfysocks »

amelius wrote: post #57
Aurornis wrote: post #17

This is all so frustrating. Tesla could have easily been an American auto maker generational success story. Instead they’re working hard to undermine their own success, turn their brand toxic, and even design vehicles that are unappealing to key purchasing demographics (Cybertruck).

No. For all practical purposes, Chinese cars are perfectly fine for most consumers. Since you cannot beat China on manufacturing costs, this war is already lost. Musk or no Musk.

Yeah, EVs are completely mundane now. Not sexy enough of a story to justify the high PE ratios anymore.

I think this is the reason for the weird pivot to humanoid robots and for taking SpaceX public even though he originally said he wouldn’t. Better story for the investors than EVs.

Re: Tesla Is Sitting on a Record 50k Unsold EVs

#147

Post by jongjong »

ndsipa_pomu wrote: post #100
jongjong wrote: post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What did he do specifically to crater his reputation? Is it his politics? He seems to have reasonable beliefs there. It's not like he's been supporting Trump unconditionally. He doesn't always agree with Trump. Is it because of his stance in favor of free speech? How is that a bad thing? As someone who doesn't like any side of politics, I don't get it.

Two very public Nazi salutes without any attempt to deny it afterwards will certainly crater anyone's reputation. It's not really politics, but more a question of humanity, but then people don't become billionaires without having a contempt for others and a desire to underpay and mistreat everyone you come into contact with.

He did deny it multiple times on Twitter/X. Probably your news source of choice is the one which omitted this fact.

I think it probably did look a bit that way and maybe he did it for engagement, maybe he intended to create controversy or maybe it was none of these things. In any case, it wasn't an actual Nazi salute.

Re: Tesla Is Sitting on a Record 50k Unsold EVs

#148

Post by array_key_first »

MPSimmons wrote: post #30
Aurornis wrote: post #17

This is all so frustrating. Tesla could have easily been an American auto maker generational success story. Instead they’re working hard to undermine their own success, turn their brand toxic, and even design vehicles that are unappealing to key purchasing demographics (Cybertruck).

Yes, Elon's trajectory has been absolutely unbelievable since 2019 or so. Talk about a guy who cratered his whole reputation. It's a shame.

He really managed to snatch defeat from the jaws of victory.

Re: Tesla Is Sitting on a Record 50k Unsold EVs

#149

Post by Hikikomori »

eudamoniac wrote: post #117
girvo wrote: post #102

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Induction requires your cookware to sit flat against the surface or it won’t heat up Not really. You’ve obviously not used modern induction cooktops (though if you’ve gone to a restaurant you’ve eaten from it). > The temperature profile of a round-bottom wok over gas flame is also superior to a flat-bottom wok on induction Explain why induction cooktops are incredibly widespread across modern Asian restaurants. You…

There's a misconception that Chinese food requires a 50,000 BTU burner causing "wok hei" to be right. The truth is that Chinese cuisine is huge and varied. Some regional dishes do actually require that. Most do not and can be cooked at home. An equivalent induction stove would be around 5000W, which I think exists. The problem with inductioning a wok is the tossing motion removes the wok from the heat, unlike over a…

There are wok shaped induction cookers.

Re: Tesla Is Sitting on a Record 50k Unsold EVs

#150

Post by greekrich92 »

jcranmer wrote: post #113
greekrich92 wrote: post #111

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Damn it's really an infringement on our rights that they cracked down on people yelling "fire" in a crowded theater

This is your regularly mandated PSA that the quote about "yelling 'fire' in a crowded theater" comes from Schenck v US, which used that analogy to justify why the government could ban people from protesting the draft in WW1. It is not good law anymore, and has been fully superseded since the Brandenburg v Ohio case which limited the exemption to "imminent lawless action."

Oh well when you put it that way, I guess it's good that kids are dying of measles again.
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