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IDEmacs: A Visual Studio Code clone for Emacs

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Re: IDEmacs: A Visual Studio Code clone for Emacs

#141

Post by DonaldPShimoda »

femiagbabiaka wrote: post #97
kleiba wrote: post #94

Long-time (25+ years) Emacs user. The first thing I do on a new installation is turn off the GUI features (like, menus and toolbars) - no-one I know who uses Emacs uses the mouse.

VSCode users, especially new ones, do. The best property of Emacs is that you can modify the lisp machine to do whatever you want.

> the lisp machine

I wonder whether this was intentional or a coincidence, but for others (and maybe you) the "Lisp Machine" was a real hardware architecture unrelated to emacs: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lisp_machine

Re: IDEmacs: A Visual Studio Code clone for Emacs

#142

Post by yanhangyhy »

setopt wrote: post #95
yanhangyhy wrote: post #44

i still use emacs everyday, with the native UI. but i love the idea of this project. Personaly i never get used to the UI of VSCode. seems so hard to understand because in emacs you deal with functions not UI buttons.

> Personaly i never get used to the UI of VSCode. seems so hard to understand because in emacs you deal with functions not UI buttons. I prefer both Vim and Emacs over VSCode, but I teach intro programming at a university and use VSCode in the lectures. VSCode is actually quite decent if you use it as a keyboard-driven thing with a distraction-free interface. By the former, I mean that Cmd-Shift-P does the same as Em…

well, that explains a lot. i guess its me not spending time to learn the basics of VSCode but got lost in the interface. seems a quite elegant design.

Re: IDEmacs: A Visual Studio Code clone for Emacs

#143

Post by aaravchen »

jlarocco wrote: post #117

Next up, how to make your Ferrari into a Fiero clone. Seriously, though, this seems kind of counterproductive. The power of Org mode and some of the other tools in Emacs comes from being integrated into the rest of Emacs and the synergies from Emacs idioms and concepts working everywhere in Emacs. Just my opinion, but the time spent learning this front end would be better spent just learning the Emacs UI. It's really…

It's more like how to put a modern day car dash over an F16 fighter jet. One has modern expectations and standards everyone is already familiar with but far less power and features, while the other existed before usability was even an idea but has more power and features than even most experts can handle. And in this case (and analogy), you can always slowly remove parts of the interface that hide the more powerful features.

I say this as a 10 year Emacs user who left for VSCode and Zed because I decided I'd rather discover new modern features when they became useful (VSCode/Zed) rather than having to hunt them down when I became too fed up with the status quo and then have to spend weeks figuring out how to get them working (Emacs). That said, I keep itching to go back for some of the power features. If only it weren't a full time job just maintaining a basic emacs config.

Re: IDEmacs: A Visual Studio Code clone for Emacs

#144

Post by aaravchen »

imiric wrote: post #66

This is great to see, and I'm sure it will nudge some people to give Emacs a try who wouldn't have otherwise. I've been using Emacs with a custom configuration for many years now, but when I needed a good IDE for working with modern frontend stacks about a year ago, I decided to give VSCodium a try, since the TS/LSP integration wasn't that great in Emacs. And funnily enough, I did the reverse of what this project doe…

I did exactly the same, though I wasn't an Evil mode user. I quickly found VSCod(e|ium) lacks the internals to even do many of the basic useful things of Emacs.

BTW, if you're an Evil mode user, Zed is probably your better choice. It has more focus on Vim-style keybindings.

Re: IDEmacs: A Visual Studio Code clone for Emacs

#145

Post by aaravchen »

ruguo wrote: post #25

If you don’t use it that often, you might wanna try the Emacs plugin for VS Code instead.

To be clear, this plugin is only a keymap, and just extends the built in Emacs-style keymap option of VSCode. If you did much/any mapping of any keys in Emacs, or are looking to expose more Emacs-like features, you're SOL. VWCode is simply unable to support most Emacs editing features without a significant engine expansion, and that's beyond the ability of plugins to add.

Re: IDEmacs: A Visual Studio Code clone for Emacs

#146

Post by hollerith »

aaravchen wrote: post #144
imiric wrote: post #66

This is great to see, and I'm sure it will nudge some people to give Emacs a try who wouldn't have otherwise. I've been using Emacs with a custom configuration for many years now, but when I needed a good IDE for working with modern frontend stacks about a year ago, I decided to give VSCodium a try, since the TS/LSP integration wasn't that great in Emacs. And funnily enough, I did the reverse of what this project doe…

I did exactly the same, though I wasn't an Evil mode user. I quickly found VSCod(e|ium) lacks the internals to even do many of the basic useful things of Emacs. BTW, if you're an Evil mode user, Zed is probably your better choice. It has more focus on Vim-style keybindings.

Similar story here. I used vscode for about 3 months for all my editing needs without even having Emacs installed, but returned to Emacs because of how hard it was to learn how to modify vscode (I'm not a web dev) compared to modifying Emacs and because of a vague impression that vscode is slower in responding to my inputs.

Re: IDEmacs: A Visual Studio Code clone for Emacs

#148

Post by Iwan-Zotow »

charcircuit wrote: post #58
anon291 wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is no better UI for text editing that I have ever come across. I'm not sure why so many people are resistant to the idea that emacs has the correct answer to most UI issues. More programs would stand to take lessons from emacs. Emacs is, in its own right, a very successful piece of software. When eclipse was a thing everyone was saying how great it was vs emacs. But eclipse is gone (I think?) and emacs is still…

>But eclipse is gone (I think?) and emacs is still GOATed. The 2024 stack overflow developer survey [0] puts Eclipse at over double Emac's market share. If Eclipse is gone, then Emacs is double gone. Emacs struggles to attract and retain new users. This advice is not calling existing Emacs users deprived. It's rooted from the bad defaults giving new users a bad impression of Emac's viability because the default is so…

> If emacs built out proper telemtry they could actually track

Good God, NEIN!

Re: IDEmacs: A Visual Studio Code clone for Emacs

#149

Post by self_awareness »

omnicognate wrote: post #62
roman_soldier wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This, most people that try and use these legacy editors spend most of their time configuring it get it to be as good as vs code and usually fail. A lot of wasted time and frustration when one click gives you a perfectly modern fast editor with a smorgasbord of great extensions that just work. I do use vim for quick editing of files in the terminal but never for serious work.

Not sure where you get "most" from. Personally I've found the exact opposite: Despite having been forced by work constraints to use most major IDE platforms at one point or another, sometimes for years at a time, I always come back to emacs with great relief and find it better in pretty much every way. I know better than to assume my experience is that of "most" people, though.

I've installed emacs now on ArchLinux Wayland system and its window refuses to resize (on purely default settings), and freezes the contents until I move it. Very refreshing indeed.

I bet this is some kind of a known issue, but that just reinforces my original point above.

edit: yeah, here it is: https://bugs.kde.org/show_bug.cgi?id=509871

I mean, how it's not an Emacs issue if it only happens with emacs?

Re: IDEmacs: A Visual Studio Code clone for Emacs

#150

Post by self_awareness »

skydhash wrote: post #102
torben-friis wrote: post #84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What kind of integration is a full project? Integrating language support for example is usually just heading to the plugins section, searching for the language and clicking install on the most mainstream result. My config for vscode is just like 5 lines to make keyboard travel between panes a bit more vim like, other than that I never needed to change much from defaults. For neovim the work to make it ide-like is a l…

With emacs, you can just use “customize” (for options) and “M-x” (for commands) and never care about anything else. Yes, it’s not as visible as vscode, but it’s very much the same thing. But once you learn elisp, then you have the power of a full VM at your disposal and not wait for a plugins to exist and hopefully implement your workflow. And adhoc integration (like having ticket number in comments be clickable) is…

Your argument is like... "once you learn C++ you have your whole processor at your disposal, you don't need to wait for any software because you can write it yourself."
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