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Depression lies

wilwheaton.net

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Re: Depression lies

#141

Post by locopati »

Alex3917 wrote: post #130
lsiebert wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You want to talk about statistics, but include anecdotal statements from anonymous sources, and end with an appeal to emotion. You want to state that psychiatric medicine is mostly placebo, but don't have any good criticisms to levy against double blind studies of antidepressants with placebos. Given the point of the article was encouraging/helping individuals who have depression to seek medical help, I'm not sure wh…

"You want to state that psychiatric medicine is mostly placebo, but don't have any good criticisms to levy against double blind studies of antidepressants with placebos." Because maybe he assumes you aren't too stupid to do a simple Google search. Both Emperor's New Drugs and Anatomy of an Epidemic are extraordinarily well written, it's well worth reading both, and there are all sorts of other good books on mental il…

I don't understand where your last paragraph of bile is coming from. There's been no name calling here that I can see.

Re: Depression lies

#142

Post by pharrington »

lilsunnybee wrote: post #113
luriel wrote: post #3

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Knowing you "have a problem" doesn't mean you or anyone understands the problem or what to do about it. And even if you know what to do, doesn't mean you can do it either, the psychological, social or just practical barriers can be impossible to climb. Medication has a statistical significant effect, but is often marginal at best, and most of the effect is placebo. And this assumes an accurate diagnosis, and don't co…

Yeah this post is really harmful. Antidepressants definitely have significant and varied effects, and those with depression should not be afraid to explore their chemical options, especially if it means lifting out of a life-threatening suicidal phase. Antidepressants affect various neurotransmitters in the brain, either blocking reuptake, or providing artificial analogues, etc. To say they provide mainly a placebo a…

Yes, psychoactive chemicals have a very real effect on neurotransmitters; this does not say the physical effect must bear out its stated psychiatric intent. Also while I have no real idea what was going on in the 60s, public mental hospitals in the USA are often terrible to the point of being inhumane. Alot of people I've talked to who've had long and or recurring stays in public institutions compare them, often negatively, to prisons. The private sector is infinitely better in that regard, though.

The real issue is just that psychology and psychiatry are both extremely frontier sciences. I agree that encouraging people to avoid them is harmful, but it's not apparent to me that most of what's happening in those fields isn't still largely guesswork.

Either way, I'd also like to see the studies Luriel's talking about regarding the efficacy of specific meds.

Re: Depression lies

#143

Post by Alex3917 »

locopati wrote: post #141
Alex3917 wrote: post #130

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"You want to state that psychiatric medicine is mostly placebo, but don't have any good criticisms to levy against double blind studies of antidepressants with placebos." Because maybe he assumes you aren't too stupid to do a simple Google search. Both Emperor's New Drugs and Anatomy of an Epidemic are extraordinarily well written, it's well worth reading both, and there are all sorts of other good books on mental il…

I don't understand where your last paragraph of bile is coming from. There's been no name calling here that I can see.

Read the section of text that I quoted. Someone who said something that's fundamentally correct is being criticized by a variety of other people who are too lazy to actually do the research themselves. That's the very premise of the movie Idiocracy.

Re: Depression lies

#144

Post by RollAHardSix »

jdietrich wrote: post #137

I am rather disappointed by much of the discussion in these comments. The HN community has always taken pride in being careful, analytical and data-led. If someone were to advocate an unproven cancer therapy based on anecdote, they would rightly be harshly criticised. The evidence base for SSRIs is extremely poor. The most favourable metastudies indicate only a very mild benefit, similar to that of many non-drug inte…

Excellent post. 1 point to make. I'd love to write more but I'm pressed for time right now.

"It is entirely possible that the idea of depression is itself a cause of depression" - This has been proven, again I'm sorry but I don't have the time to find the research at the moment.

Re: Depression lies

#146

Post by zethraeus »

mfceo wrote: post #90

before doing anything that this guy auggests, listen up : Leave the meds behind. meds are the last resport. you have to try everything else before doing what this guy did and let go of your supernatural expectancies from yourself. Work less, eat better, sleep more, enjoy your life more, stress less, change your life, live healthier, enjoy enough daylight, and first make sure that you are not infact surrounded by assh…

If you're going to give medical advice that contravenes known best practices and lay blame ('stop making yourself depressed '), you'd better have something substantial to back it up with. You have nothing.

Re: Depression lies

#147

Post by nkurz »

philwelch wrote: post #128
nkurz wrote: post #126

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I haven't gone through them, but there are quite a few references here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Depressive_realism

Quite a few references refuting it as well.

Likely --- I haven't gone through them. I have no dog in this fight. I was merely offering the citations you requested, thinking you were genuinely interested in the topic. I won't make that mistake again.

Re: Depression lies

#148

Post by zethraeus »

jdietrich wrote: post #137

I am rather disappointed by much of the discussion in these comments. The HN community has always taken pride in being careful, analytical and data-led. If someone were to advocate an unproven cancer therapy based on anecdote, they would rightly be harshly criticised. The evidence base for SSRIs is extremely poor. The most favourable metastudies indicate only a very mild benefit, similar to that of many non-drug inte…

The SSRI meta-study you're referring to is very interesting.

However, anyone reading this should know that there are routine antidepressants which are not SSRIs and do not work as SSRIs are purported to.

Re: Depression lies

#149

Post by zethraeus »

kakaroto_BR wrote: post #97

I'm in this situation right now. I will try to pass this with some therapy and exercises, because the medication decreases libido and I don't want to lose my girlfriend.

There's medication which doesn't. Bring it up as a concern!

Re: Depression lies

#150

Post by ta12121 »

jdietrich wrote: post #137

I am rather disappointed by much of the discussion in these comments. The HN community has always taken pride in being careful, analytical and data-led. If someone were to advocate an unproven cancer therapy based on anecdote, they would rightly be harshly criticised. The evidence base for SSRIs is extremely poor. The most favourable metastudies indicate only a very mild benefit, similar to that of many non-drug inte…

SSRIs are the tip of the iceberg when it comes to antidepressants.
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