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Speed limiters now mandatory in all new EU cars

autoweek.com

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Re: Speed limiters now mandatory in all new EU cars

#141

Post by croes »

gruturo wrote: post #18

This is terrifying. I routinely cross a bridge with a 30ton weight limit, which my car mistakes for a 30km/h speed limit sign. I would cause an average of 2 accidents per month if I suddenly slowed from 70 to 30 and the people behind me weren't paying attention. The technology is _not_ there and this won't save lives, potentially it will cause deaths. (Yes I read the article, this is initially only "for the driver's…

>or a speed control function in which the speed of the vehicle will be gradually reduced.

Not suddenly, gradually.

Re: Speed limiters now mandatory in all new EU cars

#142

Post by mikestew »

zehaeva wrote: post #134
kodt wrote: post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This could make it impossible or dangerous to pass in many situations where it may be necessary to temporarily exceed the speed limit.

So if every car is following the speed limit, that is going as fast as they are allowed, why would any one person be passing someone else?

Perhaps parent isn’t talking about that scenario. But surely you can imagine a different scenario where this applies, right? Maybe Grandma Jones doing 10 under the limit on a two-lane road?

Re: Speed limiters now mandatory in all new EU cars

#143

Post by stavros »

umvi wrote: post #135
stavros wrote: post #63

Leaving aside the concerns about the tech not working well, I'm really not a fan of this pre-crime stuff. This feels very Big Brother, where someone (or some system) is watching over you so you don't break any laws. Things like this lead to cultural ossification and are a nightmare scenario for me.

One possible future includes one or more of: - AI guns that won't shoot at other people, only authorized in-season animals. - AI keyboards that won't let you type "hate speech" - AI browsers that only let you visit approved, legal sites. - AI smartphones that contact the police if you are breaking curfew, trespassing, recording unauthorized (copyrighted) public or audio, etc.

You don't need AI for the browser thing, stuff is already blocked at the DNS level.

Re: Speed limiters now mandatory in all new EU cars

#144

Post by bigfudge »

kodt wrote: post #70
VyseofArcadia wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Agreed that the general case is hard to solve. I think you could at least make a case for solving a simpler problem. What's the highest legal speed limit in the country in which the car was sold? Set a global speed limit to that.

This could make it impossible or dangerous to pass in many situations where it may be necessary to temporarily exceed the speed limit.

You sound like a motoring journalist. Honestly, if you’re exceeding the speed limit to pass you’re unlikely to be gaining much anyway. 99% of the time people should just chill out and accept that driving a car already comes with so many unpaid externalities that not killing other people with your tonne of steel is a reasonable compromise. Speed is the major contributor to mortality and injury on the roads (and in developed countries the leading cause of death in some age groups).

Also, can some describe in detail a scenario where accelerating makes things safer than simply slowing down. Or where the knowledge that a speed limiter would kick in would not already have changed behaviour in a safety enhancing way?

Re: Speed limiters now mandatory in all new EU cars

#145

Post by rickydroll »

wiredfool wrote: post #62
CalRobert wrote: post #5

While it can be overridden, hopefully this saves many lives. We limit speeds on scooters and e bikes so cars are only fair

Was driving a rental with speed limit indicators and warning beeps this weekend in Germany. Over the course of a couple days, it was maybe 95% correct, but had major issues with what were probably former construction zones on the Autobhan and some limits near towns. There were a few times where it was giving technically correct "national speed limit" answers for .. not fast roads. On the Autobahn, it wanted me to slo…

I agree with you. My partner's car has lane-keeping and active cruise control. I also find lane-keeping to be more exhausting than helpful. On the other hand, active cruise control is wonderful. It keeps me from getting bored because I'm watching traffic and trying to anticipate when the cruise control changes the speed up or down.

I use cruise control whenever possible, even around town. We have some communities where speeding fines are considered city revenue, so I set my cruise control to what the sign says, and I don't worry about losing track and accidentally speeding. Since I have a plug-in hybrid, I can brake faster because I can grab the regenerative braking paddle on the steering wheel faster than I can move my foot to the brake pedal.

Re: Speed limiters now mandatory in all new EU cars

#146

Post by throw_a_grenade »

This system is already in use for lorries, which are hard limited (like the last option described in TFA — engine loses power if driver attepts to accelerate beyond the limit). It's an absolute hell for other users of the road, because they're hard limited to 100 km/h, even on roads where the legal limit is higher. Now the problem is, no two vehicles have exactly the same limit, it varies a noticeable amount, so inevitably one lorry driver will attempt to overtake another one — with speed difference below 1 km/h, at about 100 km/h where legal limit is 140 km/h. It takes about 2 min and usually causes 2-3 km "jams" on motorways.

Re: Speed limiters now mandatory in all new EU cars

#147

Post by novagameco »

isatty wrote: post #133
novagameco wrote: post #112

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In my state, it's illegal to go over the speed limit at any point, for any reason. If you want to pass someone, you do so in the left lane, at the speed limit, and then move back over to the middle/right lane. And you best believe you'll get pulled over

And what state is that? I do know that some states are over zealous about this but two vehicles driving next to each other slowing gaining on another to overtake is also creating a dangerous road situation. This is taught when you take your written test in CA. Trucks don’t really have a choice which is why it’s normal for them to do so even on a two lane highway.

Virginia

> two vehicles driving next to each other slowing gaining on another to overtake is also creating a dangerous road situation

Then perhaps you shouldn't pass if it's not safe to do so. My problem with everyone in this thread and who is against speed limiters is: the subtext is that they want to go faster than the speed limit so they can arrive faster. It's simply the fact that people are willing to engage is an extremely dangerous activity multiple times a day so that they can save a few minutes a day. The idea that people should have the right to go dangerously fast because it's simply more convenient for them is a psychotic proposition to me

Re: Speed limiters now mandatory in all new EU cars

#148

Post by akira2501 »

gwbas1c wrote: post #93

Honestly, I think it makes more sense to start with limiting cars somewhere around 90-110MPH; IE, the fastest that anyone would ever drive on a public road. Where I live, speed limits are routinely set artificially low due to a cultural belief that rules are meant to be broken. IE, if the safest speed is 75MPH, then the speed limit is set to 55MPH because everyone will break the rule. If the limit was really 75MPH, t…

> then the speed limit is set to 55MPH

The speed limit is set to 55MPH because the road services vehicles that weigh 600lbs all the way up to 80,000lbs. "Safe speed" is not a single universal number for a given stretch of road.

The laws even acknowledge this, as if the weather is extremely unfavorable, you can be pulled over for driving _at_ the speed limit as it will be declared "unsafe speed under given conditions."

This doesn't even approach things like construction zones, traffic accidents and other roadway hazards that can't be flagged in a way for the automated system to recognize correctly.

Re: Speed limiters now mandatory in all new EU cars

#149

Post by itishappy »

throw_a_grenade wrote: post #110
teraflop wrote: post #7

Seems misleading for the headline to call this a "speed limiter", since depending on the implementation it either doesn't affect the car's speed at all, or slows it down in an immediately overrideable way. So there is no actual limit on the car's speed.

From TFA: “The EU regulations permit a system that can use [...], or a speed control function in which the speed of the vehicle will be gradually reduced.” Sounds a hell lot like an actual limiter.

> "Even in the case of speed control function, where the car speed will be automatically gently reduced, the system can be smoothly overridden by the driver by pressing the accelerator pedal a little bit deeper," the European Commission adds.

Re: Speed limiters now mandatory in all new EU cars

#150

Post by bigfudge »

matsemann wrote: post #109
umvi wrote: post #97

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The question is: will this prevent more deaths [than the alternative] I hate that question. It's pure utilitarianism and is used all the time to rationalize removing/limiting freedoms in exchange for safety and security. Deaths prevented should not be the ultimate metric unless a totalitarian police state that keeps everyone perfectly safe at all times is the desired end goal. In this case I would rather have the f…

Driving above the limit isn't a "freedom". Driving is a privilege. Hence why it needs training and a certificate.

I completely agree let’s just frame this as my freedom not to be mown down by speeding distracted drivers and be done with it. If you want to speed, pay for a track day.
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