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Lawmakers Drink Raw Milk to Celebrate Legality, Become Immediately Sick (2016)

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Re: Lawmakers Drink Raw Milk to Celebrate Legality, Become Immediately Sick (2016)

#141

Post by tobylane »

Reggie_Walls wrote: post #62
elhudy wrote: post #21

I put raw cream in my coffee daily, but don’t have the balls to drink raw milk. That said, it makes fantastic yogurt. I don’t really understand the concept of illegal raw milk though. Why can’t people consume raw milk if they want? If anything, make it illegal to feed to children (except of course, raw breast milk!!)

I used to get illegal raw milk delivered in the US. I don't think it should be legal for reasons mentioned in the article (poison risk). There are enough alternatives now that prohibition works. Counterarguments? Is there a big need for dairy milk if, say, oat milk or something else can provide the calcium and other vital nutrients Americans usually get from milk?

Oat milk is great as milk, especially if you’re having porridge. The enriched oat milk I get has vitamins but not calcium.

My dad can tell the difference between oat and lactose free dairy milks in tea, so he has both in a day.

Re: Lawmakers Drink Raw Milk to Celebrate Legality, Become Immediately Sick (2016)

#142

Post by andi999 »

jamiek88 wrote: post #140
andi999 wrote: post #136

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What is wrong with raw meat? Here you can buy raw minced pork for direct consumption (on bread rolls) almost everywhere. Why should ppl get sick from that?

That’s all they eat. Just raw meat.

I agree. I had a look at the reddit, yes there is something wrong with them.

Re: Lawmakers Drink Raw Milk to Celebrate Legality, Become Immediately Sick (2016)

#143

Post by danuker »

> Raw milk is not pasteurized, or heated up to a temperature of 140 degrees F for 20 minutes, a process that kills off bacteria that can cause foodborne illness, including Salmonella, listeria, and E. coli.

This paragraph is worthy of an ambiguity contest.

1. "not pasteurized" might mean "heated up to a ..."

2. the process can cause foodborne illness

Re: Lawmakers Drink Raw Milk to Celebrate Legality, Become Immediately Sick (2016)

#144

Post by paganel »

mngnt wrote: post #59

When I was a kid, we lived in a village in northeastern Slovakia. On the hill above the village there was a farm with a big herd of cows. And every morning at around 5, a tractor would bring a few dozen litres of milk down to a small shack just by our house. People were usually waiting in line already, in a room that stank of rancid milk, to get a liter or two. When we brought the milk home, we'd pour a cup and let i…

I commented about it above, also, we (me and my brother) used to do the same thing when we were kids, in rural Romania (a village near the Carpathians). Immediately after our grandma or our our grandpa had finished milking the cows we (meaning me and my brother) would eat out with a spoon the foam-y thing that was forming on top of the bucket full of milk that had just come out of the cows. We did that my entire childhood (so from when when I was about 5 to my early 20s, so into my early adulthood), never had any health-related issues with it. In fact that is one of my fondest memories when it comes to my grandparents.

Re: Lawmakers Drink Raw Milk to Celebrate Legality, Become Immediately Sick (2016)

#145

Post by tobylane »

rmason wrote: post #27

I've met multiple times with state legislators in Michigan about an open data bill a group of us are trying to get passed. The irony is hackers or state residents wouldn't be the biggest beneficiary's. It would be legislators and their staffs. It is simply astounding how often bad decisions by legislators aren't a reflection of their poor judgement but simply poor data. Lobbyists can often times lie without being cal…

You suggest a level of potential embarrassment that I don’t think would happen. Being wrong is hand waved away in an instant. I don’t think they share your motivations even if they understood. Good luck, I’d like to see it happen.

Re: Lawmakers Drink Raw Milk to Celebrate Legality, Become Immediately Sick (2016)

#146

Post by reducesuffering »

aunty_helen wrote: post #123
fmakunbound wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

“tuberculosis, diphtheria, typhoid, Campylobacter, Listeria, Brucella, E. coli, Salmonella, and streptococcal infections” apparently.

Sounds like a bad run through the Oregon Trail

Not without dysentery it isn’t

Re: Lawmakers Drink Raw Milk to Celebrate Legality, Become Immediately Sick (2016)

#147

Post by manquer »

credit_guy wrote: post #132
29athrowaway wrote: post #112

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Per cup (whole/pasteurized -> whole/boiled) - Calories: 152 -> 146 - Protein: 8.14 g -> 8 g - Carbs: 12 g -> 11.4 g - Calcium: 28% DV -> 23% DV - Vitamin D: 24% DV -> 13% DV - Vitamin B12: 18% DV -> 13% DV - Phosphorus: 22% DV -> 20% DV

So boiling reduces the amount of calories? And carbs, and proteins? How can that be? In principle boiling could induce a lot of evaporation, so the milk would be more concentrated, and so it would have more calories per cup. But people don’t boil the milk so much as to materially reduce the amount of water in it.

The chemical breakdown of bonds also generates thermal energy, so the milk emits black-body radiation slightly more than input heat alone accounts for.

Re: Lawmakers Drink Raw Milk to Celebrate Legality, Become Immediately Sick (2016)

#148

Post by deserted »

saagarjha wrote: post #115
chii wrote: post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think instead of straight prohibit, raw milk should be purchasable if the buyer understands the dangers, and knows how to treat their own usage so that it's safe - for example, they boil it themselves. There's plenty of things that are dangerous and can kill you, but we don't and shouldn't prohibit it all. Instead, society should aim to educate, and also put in warning labels etc.

Genuinely curious: why would you want to pasteurize your own milk? I get the “homemade cake” reasoning for desserts but I see very little benefit to pasteurizing milk yourself.

You can pasteurize it yourself with very little extra effort when making espresso drinks, since you need to heat the milk with a steam wand anyway. The flavor and especially foam of a cappuccino are slightly better when made with self-pasteurized-while steaming raw milk vs equivalent non raw Jersey milk in my at home blind taste tests.

Re: Lawmakers Drink Raw Milk to Celebrate Legality, Become Immediately Sick (2016)

#149

Post by qwertox »

RealityVoid wrote: post #109
folli wrote: post #92

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think it's a modern western cultural thing that everything that's more 'natural', 'untreated', 'non-GMO'... is automatically considered more healthy, see also antivaxxers etc. Without any evidence of course.

It's like it stems from some sort of self-hatred, as if we have this belief deep down that we are wrong or corrupted and whatever we are not MUST be good. These naturalistic fallacies are certainly a strange, ilogical thing, but one at the core belief of _many_ people. I wonder if it's a western thing though and if we don't find it in other cultures as well.

I'm not really sure if it's that. If you look at the ingredient list of most of the products you buy, there's a ton of things in there which can cause allergies or other problems, if you consume too much of them.

It's ok to want something in its most natural form, but you have to make sure that the body is designed to deal with it. Like, don't eat raw potatoes or drink raw milk.

Re: Lawmakers Drink Raw Milk to Celebrate Legality, Become Immediately Sick (2016)

#150

Post by manquer »

unmole wrote: post #134
voakbasda wrote: post #131

I milk my own herd of dairy cows and goats. I drink the milk raw, and it is far superior to pasteurized milk both in taste and purity. Raw milk is nearly perfectly sterile when it comes out of a freshly cleaned teat. After that, virtually every microorganism wants to grow in it. The equipment must be handled and cleaned with precision and diligence. Any contamination provides a seed that will grow uncontrollably. I t…

> far superior to pasteurized milk both in taste and purity. How does pasteurisation make the milk less pure? > Sure, the heat kills them, but it does not remove them from the milk. All of their proteins are still there and will be consumed. So? > I used to get sick from drinking store bought milk, and I believe it was due to the literal shit that they allow to enter into the process. Loads of people also believe tha…

pasteurisation and heating in general breaks down some molecules in the milk that makes it less "pure" and alters the taste you can feel.
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