How to lower the price of plant-based meat • Hacker News Board

Re: How to lower the price of plant-based meat

#141

Post by tomstoms » Sat, Feb 06, 2021, 9:35 PM UTC

YeGoblynQueenne wrote: post #112

aaronblohowiak wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There are plenty of very healthy meat-avoiding people in the world. Malnutrition is also a problem in the world. Malnutrition from people eating fake meat? So far, not a problem.

>> Malnutrition from people eating fake meat? So far, not a problem. Because there aren't that many. For people eating a vegetarian or vegan diet, keeping well-fed is a real concern and not everyone is pulling it off. For example, the following article is about infant nutrition but some of its comments apply to adults: Vegetarian diets in childhood and adolescence : Position paper of the nutrition committee, German S…

So we need research and educational efforts into plant based nutrition instead of pumping all tax money into marketing and subsidies for the meat and dairy industry. Big surprise.

I’m raising two perfectly healthy vegan kids. They are above average on most factors that matter and continue to amaze people around us when we tell them they are vegan.

There is so much misinformation out there, and extrapolating from cases where parents fuck up isn’t helpful. All kinds of people fuck up, vegans or not, be it due to ignorance, incompetence or negligence.

Re: How to lower the price of plant-based meat

#142

Post by cataphract » Sat, Feb 06, 2021, 9:36 PM UTC

goatinaboat wrote: post #101

gus_massa wrote: post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The last election was in 2019 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2019_European_Parliament_elect...

To the figurehead, talking shop parliament. Effectively all the power in the EU belongs to the commission, which is appointed not elected.

In most European countries, people don't elect the national government directly as well; it's formed taking into account parliament elections. It is true that in the EU the appointment of the commission is a bit more removed, with the national governments involved in the choice of the President and the commissioners, but in any case the European Parliament must still approve the commission.

Re: How to lower the price of plant-based meat

#143

Post by WaitWaitWha » Sat, Feb 06, 2021, 9:36 PM UTC

A tangential topic - I really think that in general calling plant-based things "meat", a terrible idea. It does not promote plant-base diet or meat consumption reduction. It is trying to be what is not.

I think it pushes away those who are on the cusp of moving towards plant-base foods. Why? Because the consumer is told it is "meat", so they will compare it to meat. They will compare these patties to a real, prime Angus burger.

If we could be honest and declare them what they are, plant-based patties (come up with new name or whatever, plenty of plant-based names in non-English languages) I think it would improve the general image and consumption of these products.

Suddenly we would not be locked in the "meat" category. We can have all kinds of flavors for these products, instead of "meat" flavor, not having to "live up to" the meat taste, and mouth feel. We can live up to great flavors vegetables, fruits, and herbs.

Re: How to lower the price of plant-based meat

#144

Post by nicpottier » Sat, Feb 06, 2021, 9:37 PM UTC

hn_throwaway_99 wrote: post #89

ebiester wrote: post #29

I disagree with some of the premises. First, I think that the right choice is to pick the right protein for the job, and not choose wheat and soy because of price. Mung beans, for example, are expensive because people aren't growing them. If quantity demanded grows, so will supply and supply chains, which will lower the price. It is possible that mung beans (as an example) are marginally more expensive to grow for so…

The thing that I found incredibly strange about this analysis is that it is saying how older plant-based products from Morningstar and Gardein show it can be done cheaper. What??? I don't even consider those older veggie products in the same category as Impossible and Beyond, mainly because I think they taste like shit. Well, not shit exactly, but for me an Impossible Burger can completely satiate my hunger for meat.…

100 percent agree. I'm almost entirely vegetarian but would occasionally allow myself a burger as a treat as it is one of my favorite meals when I have a real hankering. A Beyond or Impossible patty now completely satisfied that craving. They really have done a great job of it. Note I am not saying they are indistinguishable from real beef, but they are meaty enough in a way that scratches the itch which previous products never did.

Re: How to lower the price of plant-based meat

#145

Post by Falling3 » Sat, Feb 06, 2021, 9:38 PM UTC

bearbawl wrote: post #132

Falling3 wrote: post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is no way to satisfy the growing demand for meat in a way that is not damaging to the environment. And that's leaving aside any questions of ethics for the animals themselves.

There is no way to satisfy the growing in a way that is not damaging to the environment. And that’s leaving aside any questions of ethics themselves.

Sorry, I'm not following what you were trying to do there. Are you trying to bring this back around to human population growth?

Re: How to lower the price of plant-based meat

#146

Post by websites222 » Sat, Feb 06, 2021, 9:38 PM UTC

bearbawl wrote: post #109

websites222 wrote: post #83

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why shouldn’t it be called meat?

Because that’s not meat?

Sure it is. It’s right there on the label. Things are called what they are called not because they have properties which match a platonic ideal and those properties are inextricably linked with the phonetic and orthographic representations of a language. No, things are called what they are called because lots of people make those sounds or write those symbols and associate it with that thing, which people receive as information and then use themselves.

In other words, you’ve already lost this battle, and you’ve lost it in many languages and countries at once.

Whatever world you wish to preserve in which, for whatever reasons of comfort you insist that plant-based meat isn’t meat, no longer exists.

Re: How to lower the price of plant-based meat

#147

Post by hamax » Sat, Feb 06, 2021, 9:39 PM UTC

bearbawl wrote: post #109

websites222 wrote: post #83

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why shouldn’t it be called meat?

Because that’s not meat?

Definition of meat by merriam-webster:

a: FOOD especially : solid food as distinguished from drink

b: the edible part of something as distinguished from its covering (such as a husk or shell)

Re: How to lower the price of plant-based meat

#148

Post by Judgmentality » Sat, Feb 06, 2021, 9:39 PM UTC

dehrmann wrote: post #92

nicoburns wrote: post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Tesla has also proved the market and accelerated the EV roadmaps of most of the other car manufactures.

True, it's done great things for EVs. It has yet to turn that into a business that's more than nominally profitable, so you should be cautious in using its playbook.

> [Tesla] has yet to turn that into a business that's more than nominally profitable, so you should be cautious in using its playbook.

And all their profits come from selling carbon credits to competitors, not from selling cars. Not to mention non-refundable presales for FSD functionality.

That's not to say Tesla shouldn't be doing those things. They are trying to run a company after all. But it's important to remember that when judging them on the viability of their business and how profitable it is. One of my favorite automobile companies, Porsche, has a very long complicated history with more than one moment of nearly going bankrupt, and their greatest savior was the VW squeeze so I'm not necessarily opposed to this sort of thing.

Re: How to lower the price of plant-based meat

#149

Post by WaitWaitWha » Sat, Feb 06, 2021, 9:39 PM UTC

danShumway wrote: post #46

sparrish wrote: post #2

It really shouldn't be called "meat". It should be called plant-based protein or meat-substitute. The definition of "meat" shouldn't change because you press some soy to look like a chicken leg.

Is anyone really confused by this though? To be honest, this sounds like the same controversy as people complaining about almond "milk". I just don't see a lot of evidence that people are regularly accidentally buying vegan food. Meat has been used to refer to non-animal products for a long time, particularly around nuts. I don't think that the definition has changed as much as people are using a commonly understood…

In my experience I think so, as I wrote on this thread.

I work with some inner city folk and yes, they are convinced it is meat, just really bad meat. As with almond milk, they think it is milk with almond added to it (even when I pull out the container from the fridge and show the ingredient list).

Re: How to lower the price of plant-based meat

#150

Post by ben_w » Sat, Feb 06, 2021, 9:39 PM UTC

dragonwriter wrote: post #72

aaronblohowiak wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There are plenty of very healthy meat-avoiding people in the world. Malnutrition is also a problem in the world. Malnutrition from people eating fake meat? So far, not a problem.

> There are plenty of very healthy meat-avoiding people in the world Yes, but they don't tend to eat much in the way of highly-processed meat simulants crafted from plants.

Because they’re new and expensive? And surely that means “sample size small so consequence unstudied” rather than “this stuff is bad to eat”?