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Oatly: The New Coke?

divinations.substack.com

141–150 of 429 posts

Re: Oatly: The New Coke?

#141
post #65

> The evidence for the harms of canola oil is still in its early days, but continues to grow. Research has linked it to: Memory impairment [1], Alzheimer’s risk [1], Cardiovascular disease [2], [5], [6], [8], Diabetes [2], Increased all-cause mortality [2], [6], [7], Metabolic syndrome [3], Decreased brain function [4], and Oxidative stress [5], [7]. Most of these references talk about how there is no clear benefit o…

For completeness, I checked them all and the score is:

* Rat

* Rat

* actually about cooking _in_ canola oil

* about switching _any_ vegetable oil to _less_ olive oil

* Rat

* actually about a different oil with quite different content of the active acid being trialled

* Rat

* Rat

(Oh, and the article is written by a SEO marketer)

Re: Oatly: The New Coke?

#142
post #24

Any recommendations for a different good-tasting, ‘healthy’ milk alternative, then? Porridge or cereal with water is inedible...

Milk is healthy, there is a reason they used to give it to school age children on a government subsidized program. The new wave of alternative milk is an ethical one even if it poses as a health one. You don't get skinny by having a soy latte instead of a regular one, you get skinny by reducing your meal size and or frequency and eating whole foods.

Re: Oatly: The New Coke?

#143
> Oatly compares their sugar to the sugar in cow’s milk, but they’re not the same sugar. Lactose, the sugar in cow’s milk, has a GI of 46. Since the GI is a measure of how much of a negative response your body has to certain sugars, the 7g of sugar in Oatly with its 100+ GI is actually potentially worse than the 12g of sugar in whole milk with a 46 GI. We can use something called the “glycemic load” to measure this, which gives us a GL for the sugar in 8oz of Oatly of 7.35, and a GL for the sugar in 8oz of whole milk of 5.52.

The "glycemic load" is just the result of the multiplication of the sugar mass by the glycemic index: 7x1.05=7.35 and 12x0.46=5.52; it would be more clear to simply state that.

Re: Oatly: The New Coke?

#144
post #100

"Made for humans" also draws attention to the fact that the milk you're drinking from a cow is not being drank by the offspring of that cow like it normally would and many people don't realise you have to keep making diary cows give birth to get more milk. Newly born male cows are usually turned into veal in a few weeks and female cows are separated from their mothers so they don't drink the valuable milk. Milk givin…

I’m ideologically positive to vegetarianism and veganism but I’m so sick of this argument. Something being “made for humans” is in no way a positive — so is cocaine.

> Something being “made for humans” is in no way a positive — so is cocaine.

It's more of a spin from the phase "milk is for baby cows" though (not sure what the equivalent would be for cocaine). I used to roll my eyes at this as a naturalistic fallacy but point the being made here is:

1) cows do not give milk unless they've been pregnant

2) the newly born calves need to be separated from their mothers so there's more milk sell

There's no similar ethical difficult with oats.

Re: Oatly: The New Coke?

#145
I'm sympathetic to marketing counterfactuals, so I wanted to like this article, but its claims did not sway me.

- The appalling environmental footprint of the dairy industry was never addressed.

- The canola oil claims cited were nowhere near conclusive (see twanvl and NotOscarWilde's comments below).

- The nutritional comparison seemed to me to be more or less trivial.

Okay, it's got a higher glycemic index and similar sugar content compared to cow milk. If you share the author's concern about tacitly "health-adjacent" marketing, this is problematic, but not an outright lie. At worst the product has a pretty comparable nutritional portfolio to cow milk. Seems appropriate for a "milk substitute," no?

The author engages in a little deceptive rhetoric himself by setting a 12oz serving as the baseline. It's true that a portion that size is bad for you. Lattes are bad for you. Like many people, though, I only rarely use milk substitutes to add a dash of not-coffee to coffee that would otherwise be too hot or too burnt. Guess I shouldn't be concerned?

- Most glaringly, the moral dimension of dairy consumption is never addressed. I won't harp on about this too much as many other commenters have already, but this seemed like a glaring omission: who cares about sugar content if the alternative is needless suffering? I guess you could have the best of both worlds by not drinking a milk substitute in the first place, but that's not Oatly's market segment, so...

Overall, this article came away as basically validating Oatly's marketing claims to me. Which is frustrating, since as I stated above, I'm biased toward marketing scrutiny!

Re: Oatly: The New Coke?

#146
post #24

Any recommendations for a different good-tasting, ‘healthy’ milk alternative, then? Porridge or cereal with water is inedible...

Almond Breeze almond milk, original flavor (don't get the unsweetened version).

That's way too sweet for my liking; for me, nothing comes close to Califia brand unsweetened original flavor.

Re: Oatly: The New Coke?

#147
post #95

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why doesn't soy milk work? There's soy milk and there's soy milk; the various brands taste quite different.

Thanks - I’ll give it a go.

The brand of soy milk popular for coffee etc. in Australia is Bonsoy (japanese brand), and it's worth giving a try. They did poison people a few years back, but that's a price worth paying for good tasting soy, right? In my travels I've found that most soy milk consumed around the world is pretty awful. I don't know why. There's a lot more variance in its taste than with most other cow's milk substitutes.

Re: Oatly: The New Coke?

#148

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Avocado oil is much better than olive oil, which has a low boiling point.

It's probably equivalent but the taste doesn't go with most foods, also it goes bad much easier which again suggests less stability.

If you're concerned about the taste of Avocado oil you may have just had poor quality oil. I've had some bad experiences, but the one from Chosen Foods (we have it at Costco in Ontario) is a very neutral oil with a high smoke point.

Re: Oatly: The New Coke?

#149
post #18

I don't drink dairy due to intolerance and I find it disgusting possibly for the same reason. I also don't like any milk substitute so I'm out of any target demographic anyway. However, as far as I know according to traditional Chinese medicine milk is considered a big no no.

Try eating shredded carrots with coconut oil, olive oil and salt on an empty stomach once a day. In a couple of weeks try drinking milk again. If your milk intolerance is due to a bacterial overgrowth you should be able to tolerate it after that.

Re: Oatly: The New Coke?

#150
I drink milk, but I think the strongest case against drinking cows milk is industrial-scale dairy farming. We (consumers) are to blame because we want milk as cheap as possible.

We've seen protests across Europe in the past by farmers who say they can't provide milk at such cheap prices and maintain welfare standards. Unfortunately, we consumers seem unwilling to pay for high welfare. Sure we say otherwise when asked, but our actions at the supermarket tell a different story.

Also, most consumers don't even know what conditions are like for dairy animals. In Europe, consumers smugly assume we have high welfare standards (maybe we do relative to other countries), but I was shocked to learned that some farms still tie and tether cows in small cramped indoor spaces [1]. In fact, most dairy cows will spend the majority of their life indoors rather than outside grazing on pasture. This is the price of cheap, industrial-scale agriculture.

[1] https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2018/dec/08/its-medi...

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