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System76 Will Ship Linux Laptops With Coreboot-Based Open-Source Firmware

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Re: System76 Will Ship Linux Laptops With Coreboot-Based Open-Source Firmware

#141

Post by bproven »

pgeorgi wrote: post #107
SirensOfTitan wrote: post #104

I spent a lot of time deliberating on what to replace my 13” MBP with. The idea of more open hardware is attractive, but both system76 and purism fell short (mainly battery life) I ended up going with a Lenovo x1 carbón extreme and threw ArchLinux on it. The trackpad is worse, and battery life isn’t quite as good (I feel like I can optimize this, but haven’t had the chance yet), but it’s such a capable machine. I fee…

> battery life isn’t quite as good powertop --auto-tune is a good first start in my experience.

yeah and tlp - although my guess is i think the nvidia graphics are hurting you here

Re: System76 Will Ship Linux Laptops With Coreboot-Based Open-Source Firmware

#142

Post by akincisor »

jackpot51 wrote: post #3

I am Jeremy Soller, Principal Engineer at System76. Let me know if you have any questions. The source for this can be found here: https://github.com/system76/firmware-open There are instructions there for building and testing the firmware in QEMU, you do not need to have our hardware to try it out.

I would really love if the system76 laptops had hardware kill switches for the camera and the microphone. If the camera switch also physically occludes the lens, that would be great.

Re: System76 Will Ship Linux Laptops With Coreboot-Based Open-Source Firmware

#143

Post by tpearson-raptor »

m463 wrote: post #87
awinter-py wrote: post #11

BYO software is my #3 consumer electronics question (after form factor & 'does it work at all') and drivers are an important frontier of this. SO TIRED of downloading blobs to have wifi on linux. AFAIK there isn't even a usb wifi dongle that has an open source wifi driver, much less a commercial wifi chipset. even companies that are in theory dedicated to quality are teetering on the edge of using software to enable…

I bought a purism laptop years ago, and it had zero blobs. It also had really really standard hardware: no special screws to open the case, standard memory, m.2 and hard drive, a standard power supply with a barrel jack, etc. I believe system76 was less expensive but had blobs. Unsure about the hardware details.

Oh? Zero blobs, so no ME or PSP? No FSP or AGESA? No EC firmware or integrated GPU firmware?

Sorry, I call BS on that unless it was a long time ago, as in Core 2 Duo era.

Re: System76 Will Ship Linux Laptops With Coreboot-Based Open-Source Firmware

#144

Post by 7thaccount »

jackpot51 wrote: post #3

I am Jeremy Soller, Principal Engineer at System76. Let me know if you have any questions. The source for this can be found here: https://github.com/system76/firmware-open There are instructions there for building and testing the firmware in QEMU, you do not need to have our hardware to try it out.

Just wanted to give a shout out and say my new System76 machine is awesome and the customer support has been top notch so far. The hardware support and updates have been great and the PoPs distro is great. Thanks for a great product.

Re: System76 Will Ship Linux Laptops With Coreboot-Based Open-Source Firmware

#145

Post by tpearson-raptor »

jackpot51 wrote: post #3

I am Jeremy Soller, Principal Engineer at System76. Let me know if you have any questions. The source for this can be found here: https://github.com/system76/firmware-open There are instructions there for building and testing the firmware in QEMU, you do not need to have our hardware to try it out.

I have one.

How are you claiming open source firmware when your hardware requires signed, closed source binaries to even begin to boot? I refer specifically to the Intel Management Engine, which incidentally is why we gave up on x86 many years ago.

How did you solve the GPU closed, signed firmware problem for discrete GPUs? How about the WiFi card firmware?

I understand your decision to try to keep compatibility with games and Windows, but the result is only partly open source, and that is not what these headlines read.

I know we would be interested in assisting System76 (or other prebuilt system OEMs) to start offering POWER products as true open source, owner controlled alternatives to Intel and AMD. For instance, we currently manufacture and sell mainboards that would be a perfect fit for your existing Thelio cases, that work very well with (optional) powerful AMD GPUs -- there's also a 2D HDMI graphics option for true blob-free operation. All you need to do is qualify our mainboard in your devices, and offer software support -- it's a very low risk investment all things considered but would allow System76 to sell truly open source systems vs. partly closed ones.

Is there some possible room for collaboration here? The GPU, WiFi, etc. firmware questions are honest questions -- the firmware is potential issue, and the more OEMs/ODMs that work this problem simultaneously in collaboration the higher the chance of a solution being found that will allow even those devices to be freed up and made secure.

Re: System76 Will Ship Linux Laptops With Coreboot-Based Open-Source Firmware

#146

Post by peller »

franey wrote: post #140
tadzik_ wrote: post #138

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can't speak for System76, but I got the AMD Thinkpad (A485), and I'm honestly disappointed as hell and now I understand why you don't see the Ryzens on laptops too much. The power management is an absolute joke (the thing has two batteries and barely lasts 2 hours total), suspend works maybe 20% of the time, and the OS actually freezes on it every now and then leaving no trace in syslog. I'd much rather get an Intel…

What distro? I have a T495s and I haven't had any issues with it running Arch.

Yea, something seems fishy. My E485 (one 3-cell battery) gets 3-4 hours on Arch

Re: System76 Will Ship Linux Laptops With Coreboot-Based Open-Source Firmware

#147

Post by m463 »

tpearson-raptor wrote: post #143
m463 wrote: post #87

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I bought a purism laptop years ago, and it had zero blobs. It also had really really standard hardware: no special screws to open the case, standard memory, m.2 and hard drive, a standard power supply with a barrel jack, etc. I believe system76 was less expensive but had blobs. Unsure about the hardware details.

Oh? Zero blobs, so no ME or PSP? No FSP or AGESA? No EC firmware or integrated GPU firmware? Sorry, I call BS on that unless it was a long time ago, as in Core 2 Duo era.

I have a purism 13 first version. I didn't have to unblock non-free repos when installing linux at first. (I now run arch)

As to booting, it originally shipped with a bios, but later offered coreboot which I believe disabled the ME.

https://puri.sm/posts/purism-librem-laptops-completely-disab...

https://puri.sm/learn/blobs/

https://puri.sm/coreboot/

Re: System76 Will Ship Linux Laptops With Coreboot-Based Open-Source Firmware

#148

Post by islanderfun »

equalunique wrote: post #59
jackpot51 wrote: post #3

I am Jeremy Soller, Principal Engineer at System76. Let me know if you have any questions. The source for this can be found here: https://github.com/system76/firmware-open There are instructions there for building and testing the firmware in QEMU, you do not need to have our hardware to try it out.

Recognized the username. Blown away that the same person leading Redox-OS[0] is also in a leadership role at System76!!! [0] https://github.com/redox-os/redox/graphs/contributors

Indeed very cool. I was recently surprised to see so much Rust via Pop_os.

Re: System76 Will Ship Linux Laptops With Coreboot-Based Open-Source Firmware

#149

Post by tpearson-raptor »

m463 wrote: post #147
tpearson-raptor wrote: post #143

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Oh? Zero blobs, so no ME or PSP? No FSP or AGESA? No EC firmware or integrated GPU firmware? Sorry, I call BS on that unless it was a long time ago, as in Core 2 Duo era.

I have a purism 13 first version. I didn't have to unblock non-free repos when installing linux at first. (I now run arch) As to booting, it originally shipped with a bios, but later offered coreboot which I believe disabled the ME. https://puri.sm/posts/purism-librem-laptops-completely-disab... https://puri.sm/learn/blobs/ https://puri.sm/coreboot/

Your laptop is Broadwell according to the coreboot source.

Sorry, that means you've got a ME. Part of one (the BUP) but a required ME nonetheless:

https://www.coreboot.org/Intel_Management_Engine

Re: System76 Will Ship Linux Laptops With Coreboot-Based Open-Source Firmware

#150

Post by alexis_fr »

dharmab wrote: post #100
isantop wrote: post #94

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They're certainly no less durable than most consumer laptops. Our hinges in particular have a reputation for being nice and tight for a long period of time. They aren't ruggedized or anything (like a toughbook), but they'll last a good long while if you aren't super rough with your electronics. Mine gets tossed in a bag at the end of the day and toted around on my back via motorcycle, and I've never felt nervous abou…

> Mine gets tossed in a bag at the end of the day and toted around on my back via motorcycle, and I've never felt nervous about that at all. Glad to hear that you are using your devices outside of a clean room. Whenever I throw my work-issued Macbook in my bag and ride home, it's got dirt in the keys by the time I get home. I was the first in the office to need a keyboard replacement...

I have this phenomenon too: The macbook 2013 has a sealing rubber around the screen when you close it down to the keyboard, yet after transport, there is dust on the screen. I’ve always wondered whether something about the shape or the design sucked the dust into the screen-keyboard void when the lid is closed.
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