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Gates Foundation spent $200M funding toilet research

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Re: Gates Foundation spent $200M funding toilet research

#141
post #51

Toilets are a great example of how technological progress isn't just endless improvement. Sometimes we hit complete dead ends even on the simplest problems.

There have been lots of toilet innovations "recently".

Toilets that use excrement to generate electricity, for example, like in this situation https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-41680867.

Re: Gates Foundation spent $200M funding toilet research

#142
post #110

As an African, I can't help but think that all this charity to Africa might be contributing to us lagging behind in the world. With charities helping out so much, will the local government ever get their act together and provide these functions of public sanitation like they are supposed to? Or will they keep stealing public health funds in the knowledge that charity will always swoop down to save the day? Charities…

Funny to see people with real experience being downvoted... Typical leftists. They do the same in the US - destroying communities using welfare. I would explain how this works for the umpteenth time, but leftists never seem to listen anyway (or even bother to summarize their opposition fairly). What makes westerners think they can "save Africa" when their countries are disintegrating so quickly?

This is just part of Gate's tax sheltering. Nothing wrong with using legal tax shelters, but he's no savior!

I agree with majani's analysis!

Re: Gates Foundation spent $200M funding toilet research

#143
post #125
post #83

I've always wondered why we never really saw toilets in Star Trek. They never really could re-imagine them back then (or now). I have several fully automatic Totos (which have to abide by California/US water usage rules).. and while the bidets, seat heating, and automisting (it sprays water every 15-30 seconds to try to keep the bowl clean) features are nice the water limits and bowl design make it a pain to clean an…

> I've always wondered why we never really saw toilets in Star Trek. When the original series was made, you couldn’t show a toilet on TV – it simply wasn’t allowed. But, beginning in 1989 with the release of the feature film Star Trek V: The Final Frontier , you do get the occasional glimpse of an actual toilet here and there. http://memory-alpha.wikia.com/wiki/Toilet

Allowed as in illegal? Which country, what regulations?

Re: Gates Foundation spent $200M funding toilet research

#144

I admire Gates a lot, but for him and way too many technophiles the answer is somehow always tech. Africa does not have a toilet problem. Or a tech problem. Or even a resources problem. They have a lack of intelligent social organization problem; i.e. dysfunctional or non-existent institutions, laws and organizational structures, as well as myriad forms of corruption from top to bottom that make it impossible to crea…

hastily searches brain for a contrived intuition pump

In "Star Trek: The Next Generation", Lieutenant Commander Geordi La Forge does not have a tech problem. He has a lack-of-properly-functioning-eyes problem.

It's been solved with technology, though.

In this case, maybe technology will enable people to create a sanitary environment even in the face of impediments from the state.

Re: Gates Foundation spent $200M funding toilet research

#145

I admire Gates a lot, but for him and way too many technophiles the answer is somehow always tech. Africa does not have a toilet problem. Or a tech problem. Or even a resources problem. They have a lack of intelligent social organization problem; i.e. dysfunctional or non-existent institutions, laws and organizational structures, as well as myriad forms of corruption from top to bottom that make it impossible to crea…

That's super callous and cynical. "Some African governments are corrupt so don't do anything." Deaths from malaria in Africa fell from 800,000 per year in 2000 to 400,000 per year today because of the introduction of affordable mosquito nets. That fact alone refutes your entire arguement.

My take is not cynical, it's pragmatic, moreover, I didn't imply that Gates shouldn't doing what he is doing.

"Deaths from malaria in Africa fell from 800,000 per year in 2000 to 400,000 per year today because of the introduction of affordable mosquito nets. That fact alone refutes your entire arguement."

This statement only enhances my argument. Africa is a bountiful land of resources and ostensible human capital for labour. They should easily be able to afford (or make their own) mosquito nets.

Consider the vast numbers of unemployed people - and that making 'mosquito nets' doesn't require any skill or frankly machinery. The only ostensible 'import' would be some very inexpensive textiles. We're talking a few pennies per person. And that the 'upside' from the effort would yield dramatic benefits, to the tune of hundreds of thousands of saved lives. How on earth are zillions of people dying from something that literally only a few million dollars in 'external financing' (if they don't have the money, which they do) - and some pragmatic planning - should solve? That there needed to be intervention to solve this problem only highlights how dramatically dysfunctional the situation must be.

And as far as 'some' governments, no, it's pretty much all of them, maybe save Botswana, the shinning example, at least for now. [1]

Also - it's not just 'governments', and it's not just 'corruption' - it's lack of civic function all the way up and down society.

[1] https://www.transparency.org/news/feature/corruption_percept...

Re: Gates Foundation spent $200M funding toilet research

#146
post #51

Toilets are a great example of how technological progress isn't just endless improvement. Sometimes we hit complete dead ends even on the simplest problems.

Most things are examples of this - including Intel's latest CPU :) Seriously though, how did the so-called "futurists" get away with applying Moore's law to all innovative processes without being called charlatans? Sky scrapers don't double every 18 months, food has gotten less nutritious... Ditto for education, transportation in the west, all non-emergency medicine, and many who are even "techies" think software has recently been decreasing in quality.

Re: Gates Foundation spent $200M funding toilet research

#147

I admire Gates a lot, but for him and way too many technophiles the answer is somehow always tech. Africa does not have a toilet problem. Or a tech problem. Or even a resources problem. They have a lack of intelligent social organization problem; i.e. dysfunctional or non-existent institutions, laws and organizational structures, as well as myriad forms of corruption from top to bottom that make it impossible to crea…

Forums like this would accuse Gates of modern colonialism if he attempted any of the government reforms or accountability measures you describe.

Re: Gates Foundation spent $200M funding toilet research

#148
post #83

I've always wondered why we never really saw toilets in Star Trek. They never really could re-imagine them back then (or now). I have several fully automatic Totos (which have to abide by California/US water usage rules).. and while the bidets, seat heating, and automisting (it sprays water every 15-30 seconds to try to keep the bowl clean) features are nice the water limits and bowl design make it a pain to clean an…

>For western/developed countries I think there is still a big market for a better toilet. //

A way to _simply_ use rainwater that can be cheaply retrofitted would be good.

Re: Gates Foundation spent $200M funding toilet research

#149

I admire Gates a lot, but for him and way too many technophiles the answer is somehow always tech. Africa does not have a toilet problem. Or a tech problem. Or even a resources problem. They have a lack of intelligent social organization problem; i.e. dysfunctional or non-existent institutions, laws and organizational structures, as well as myriad forms of corruption from top to bottom that make it impossible to crea…

Forums like this would accuse Gates of modern colonialism if he attempted any of the government reforms or accountability measures you describe.

And rightfully so because the history of those kinds of interventions haven’t gone well historically.

Re: Gates Foundation spent $200M funding toilet research

#150

I admire Gates a lot, but for him and way too many technophiles the answer is somehow always tech. Africa does not have a toilet problem. Or a tech problem. Or even a resources problem. They have a lack of intelligent social organization problem; i.e. dysfunctional or non-existent institutions, laws and organizational structures, as well as myriad forms of corruption from top to bottom that make it impossible to crea…

Forums like this would accuse Gates of modern colonialism if he attempted any of the government reforms or accountability measures you describe.

Yes, that's essentially a root problem.

The corrupt leaders would use any plausible excuse to defend their fiefdoms ...'colonialism' would be an easy one to hide behind, and a lot of naive actors on our side would chime in in support. Sadly.

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