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Announcing .NET Core 1.0

blogs.msdn.microsoft.com

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Re: Announcing .NET Core 1.0

#141

Post by pjmlp »

akavel wrote: post #88
pjmlp wrote: post #81

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I went full circle, from a critic how they cloned Java back when my employer had the privilege to beta test .NET as a Microsoft partner, to someone that enjoys delivering solutions on the .NET stack. For me the sweet spot will be when .NET Native becomes more mature and I can get Delphi/Modula-3 back.

What do you mean by "getting Delphi/Modula-3 back" here? There are some implementations for .NET? or that C# is kinda similar? or something else?

C# was originally designed by Anders Hejlsberg, the C# 1.0 features that weren't taken from Java (J++) were based on Delphi, like Properties.

You also have RAD development on .NET.

Although .NET always had AOT compilation via NGEN, it always depends on the runtime being available at OS level.

With .NET Native it is like things were on PC before JVM took off, with strong typed system languages like Delphi and Modula-3 that compile directly to native code.

I know one needs a bit of imagination to make the comparison, but it is how I like to think about it.

Re: Announcing .NET Core 1.0

#142

Post by ethbro »

brudgers wrote: post #90
wvenable wrote: post #85

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Microsoft is looking to do more data-driven design; this is the reason for all the telemetry in Windows as well. Raymond Chen pointed out an example where a button was removed File Explorer (prime real-estate) because the telemetry showed that hardly anyone ever pressed it. It's unfortunate they are so tone-deaf about the PR implications in Windows.

The Story of the Ribbon video about Microsoft and data driven design. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tl9kD693ie4

Ribbon, or "How to Figure Out Where a Menu Item Is Based Solely on UX Data"*

*Customers may not be granted access to UX data

Re: Announcing .NET Core 1.0

#143

Post by pjmlp »

daveguy wrote: post #67

FYI, from the announcement. Probably the most important part at the end, italicized by me. Also note (elsewhere) that licenses are MIT and Apache2: .NET Core Tools Telemetry The .NET Core tools include a telemetry feature so that we can collect usage information about the .NET Core Tools. It’s important that we understand how the tools are being used so that we can improve them. Part of the reason the tools are in Pr…

So it is bad when Microsoft asks to do it, but ok when Eclipse, Netbeans or InteliJ do it?

They are being quite open about it and how to turn it off.

Re: Announcing .NET Core 1.0

#144

Post by bakhy »

akavel wrote: post #88
pjmlp wrote: post #81

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I went full circle, from a critic how they cloned Java back when my employer had the privilege to beta test .NET as a Microsoft partner, to someone that enjoys delivering solutions on the .NET stack. For me the sweet spot will be when .NET Native becomes more mature and I can get Delphi/Modula-3 back.

What do you mean by "getting Delphi/Modula-3 back" here? There are some implementations for .NET? or that C# is kinda similar? or something else?

i can't speak for the author, but my first thought was the speed. Delphi was almost as easy to develop as Visual Basic, but the result was fast. a native EXE, no big framework-dependencies.

Re: Announcing .NET Core 1.0

#145

Post by sherjilozair »

AndreyErmakov wrote: post #105
AndreyErmakov wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Thanks for the information! Apparently I missed that in the news stream. Sad to hear about that though. I was hoping for a break. Will just have to continue reading that PostgreSQL book I've already started.

Now that someone has downvoted me, I know it is the right choice and I must learn Postgres. Thanks for your support, folks.

PostgreSQL is the right choice, no matter what.

Re: Announcing .NET Core 1.0

#146

Post by jasselin »

What happened to the so called promised "dynamic compilation"? There was supposed to be a great improvement in compilation times...which is still quite long on the default sample.

I don't feel like Microsoft has improved enough for me to make the switch from .NET 4.x.

Re: Announcing .NET Core 1.0

#147

Post by judah »

lotsoflumens wrote: post #107
judah wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's the first version of .NET that's cross-platform, it's the first version of .NET that's totally open source, and it's the first version of .NET that can build self-contained apps (no need to have .NET Framework installed to run .NET Core 1.0 apps). See the release notes[0] for more info. It's called "core", because it doesn't contain the Windows desktop UI toolkits, like Windows Forms and Windows Presentation Fou…

>>> it's the first version of .NET that can build self-contained apps I tried it - it puts 50MB of DLLs beside the "HelloWorld" executable in a subdirectory (on Ubuntu 16.04). It's like shipping the entire Java runtime with every app.

>> "I tried it - it puts 50MB of DLLs beside HelloWorld"

That's a bad test for a framework. It's like saying, "I bought an $80,000 car to drive to my neighbor's house across the street - I could have just walked!"

A good test is, "What is the full install size of a real app built on .NET Core?"

And the answer is, not much larger than any other app. All that code has to live somewhere, either in your app or in your libraries.

Re: Announcing .NET Core 1.0

#149

Post by WorldMaker »

yread wrote: post #136

Any ideas how to do GUI development with .NET Core? Is there a version of Xamarin? Are there plans to port Windows.Forms, WPF? There is this massive thread about it http://forums.dotnetfoundation.org/t/cross-platform-wpf/421/... and an issue here https://github.com/dotnet/corefx/issues/5766

Universal Windows Platform ".NET Native" stack is aligned with (built upon/merging towards) .NET Core. It's XAML-based like WPF and Silverlight.

ETA: Other than not cross-platform. Other option is Xamarin.Forms and would be useful to see more Xamarin.Forms targets.

Re: Announcing .NET Core 1.0

#150

Post by MichaelApproved »

logfromblammo wrote: post #106
wvenable wrote: post #85

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Microsoft is looking to do more data-driven design; this is the reason for all the telemetry in Windows as well. Raymond Chen pointed out an example where a button was removed File Explorer (prime real-estate) because the telemetry showed that hardly anyone ever pressed it. It's unfortunate they are so tone-deaf about the PR implications in Windows.

We have removed all the weapon deployment buttons from our nuclear subs, silos, and bombers, because telemetry shows that they are typically only pressed during unit testing. Since we only have two recorded events of someone deploying a nuclear weapon in a real-world scenario, it should be safe to relocate those buttons off the main console, and just use the auxiliary functions button, behind the kick panel, next to…

You're joking but I'll give a serious reply to why your analogy is off. This is why they have war games. The telemetry from those games would be included in the analysis.
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