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The Android Opportunity

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Re: The Android Opportunity

#131

Post by cpr »

jamesbritt wrote: post #116
alain94040 wrote: post #58

Here at FairSoftware, we are watching closely which platform developers are most interested in, and iPhone is almost 10X ahead of Android. I have been thinking for a year that Android would catch up, but I still don't see real signs.

"Here at FairSoftware, we are watching closely which platform developers are most interested in, and iPhone is almost 10X ahead of Android." Why do you think that is? The sense I get from people interested in iPhone dev is that they think they'll make good coin from their apps.

Well, in our case (indie iPhone developer), I wouldn't touch the combinatorial explosion of testing on random hardware with random features with a 1000' pole.

Also, I hate Java--though it has GC, it's still basically a static language, and horribly verbose to boot.

Re: The Android Opportunity

#132

Post by nkurz »

AndrewO wrote: post #118
nkurz wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To the contrary, I found myself shaking my head. Why is it in Apple's interest to be forced to constantly innovate simply to maintain market share? To say that 'a monoculture is not in the consumer's interest' make perfect sense, but why wouldn't Apple prefer a case where it has no strong competition? Their goal is profit via market share, not innovation for the sake of innovation.

I disagree with the parent, but don't think he should be downmodded (at least not below 1 as it is now). He's making a point which goes against what most people here probably have, but it's prompted more discussion and was made civilly.

I appreciate your attitude. But which part do you disagree with?

I'm guessing that most people are reacting against my implication that Apple is primarily profit-driven rather than design-driven. I suppose this might be true (and probably is true of some pieces of the company), but I have trouble believing that their financial success is just a happy accident that follows naturally from their focus on design.

Or is there a different part you disagree with?

Re: The Android Opportunity

#133

Post by ezy »

joeyo wrote: post #114
ezy wrote: post #106

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is a wierd perspective. You need users other than developers on a platform to make money selling the platform and the devices. If the company doesn't make money, it can't continue to upgrade the platform and make new devices. Do you really think that a platform just for developers and gadget geeks is even sustainable over the long term? This is a whole new level of crazy...

Given that Android is open source, why does it need to make money exactly?

I don't understand, aren't there supposed to be entrepreneurs on here? Let's be honest with ourselves:

What do you plan to run your software geek nirvana on, anyway? If noone buys the platform, what happens 3 years from now?

As a meta-question: What do you think would've happened to linux and it's desktop if solaris' or even windows server licensing terms were more reasonable at the outset? If Mr Shuttleworth decided his money was better spent feeding children on his home continent rather than making Debian look nicer? Think about it...

Re: The Android Opportunity

#134

Post by potatolicious »

nailer wrote: post #124
thwarted wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is [it serving as both the Dialer and the Contacts app all rolled into one] a good idea? When I'm in my Dialer, presumably I only want to call people. Surely the system should sense context (likewise, if I'm in the email app, it should show contacts for whom I have no email!). There is a "dialer" app that shows the phone pad. There is a contacts app tha shows all your contacts. While the device has phone functionalit…

The 'People' app in the Hero also dolves a long running prob I had with my iPhone. Say I know Jeff sent me a website to look at. I can't remember whether this was via SMS or email. * On iPhone, I had to open SMS, find messages, close SMS, open email. * On Android, I just find Jeff's entry in people and look at everything he sent me - SMS, email, and calls.

I didn't know that, that does sound like a good feature :) This is the point the author was trying to get at though, I think. Right now the vanilla Android "distro" isn't compelling - the UI is pretty mediocre and there are some pretty gigantic rifts in the user experience.

We need a vendor to come in and "iPhone-ify" the experience. Smooth out the rough edges and finish the "full package" (e.g. music/podcast sync out of the box). I haven't looked into the Hero enough to know if they're it...

Re: The Android Opportunity

#135

Post by joeyo »

ezy wrote: post #133
joeyo wrote: post #114

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Given that Android is open source, why does it need to make money exactly?

I don't understand, aren't there supposed to be entrepreneurs on here? Let's be honest with ourselves: What do you plan to run your software geek nirvana on, anyway? If noone buys the platform, what happens 3 years from now? As a meta-question: What do you think would've happened to linux and it's desktop if solaris' or even windows server licensing terms were more reasonable at the outset? If Mr Shuttleworth decided…

Cell phone hardware is a commodity to a first approximation already and that will become more and more true as time goes on, Apple's attempts notwithstanding. I can't speak to Google's plans and motivations, but Android already has been ported to phones that it was not "indented" to run on, paralleling Linux development on PC hardware. Buy the platform, don't buy the platform, whatever. It will still exist and hobbyists will always be able to put it on their devices.

But that's not even the point, really. From the perspective of the cell phone manufacturers, eliminating or reducing the expense of developing an OS is good for their bottom line. As long as Android is "good enough" for most users, I foresee it continuing to be used.

Re: The Android Opportunity

#136

Post by AndrewO »

nkurz wrote: post #132
AndrewO wrote: post #118

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I disagree with the parent, but don't think he should be downmodded (at least not below 1 as it is now). He's making a point which goes against what most people here probably have, but it's prompted more discussion and was made civilly.

I appreciate your attitude. But which part do you disagree with? I'm guessing that most people are reacting against my implication that Apple is primarily profit-driven rather than design-driven. I suppose this might be true (and probably is true of some pieces of the company), but I have trouble believing that their financial success is just a happy accident that follows naturally from their focus on design. Or is t…

Well, I hope that didn't come across as being diametrically opposed to you or anything. I actually quite agree that Apple is profit-driven. Its success has mainly stemmed from learning how to profit on its design.

Apple's most successful products have been those where its best to market, rather than first to market, which by means competition is good for it by definition (most especially at the beginning). Creative Nomad and (soon at least) WinMo are evidence of that (on the other hand, there's Newton, which was way too early to market).

It remains to be seen whether or not their more successful products fall into a MS Word-like malaise (see my other comment) now that they're entrenched in the media player and smart phone spaces. My guess is that the design that has driven them to success in the past will continue to be able to head off competition, but I don't want to sound like a fan boy.

So mainly, I was disagreeing that a monoculture could be in their best interest. It may in certain cases (or other companies), but I don't think it does on average.

Re: The Android Opportunity

#137

Post by Ras_ »

pavlov wrote: post #93
Ras_ wrote: post #72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Nokia is committed to Maemo. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maemo_(operating_system) Here's the announcement: http://www.ftd.de/technik/it_telekommunikation/:Strategiewen...

It's not an "announcement". Quite the opposite: Nokia has explicitly denied FTD's report that they would be abandoning Symbian. However, phones equipped with Maemo 5 are definitely coming to the high end of Nokia's range. (Symbian's strength is that it works with substantially cheaper hardware than any of the competing smartphone OSs, which is great for Nokia, as they are particularly strong globally at the lower end…

Important correction. Incredibly I've managed to miss that one.

Re: The Android Opportunity

#138

Post by nailer »

potatolicious wrote: post #134
nailer wrote: post #124

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The 'People' app in the Hero also dolves a long running prob I had with my iPhone. Say I know Jeff sent me a website to look at. I can't remember whether this was via SMS or email. * On iPhone, I had to open SMS, find messages, close SMS, open email. * On Android, I just find Jeff's entry in people and look at everything he sent me - SMS, email, and calls.

I didn't know that, that does sound like a good feature :) This is the point the author was trying to get at though, I think. Right now the vanilla Android "distro" isn't compelling - the UI is pretty mediocre and there are some pretty gigantic rifts in the user experience. We need a vendor to come in and "iPhone-ify" the experience. Smooth out the rough edges and finish the "full package" (e.g. music/podcast sync ou…

The Hero's UI is certainly an improvement on stock Android and the iPhone. I wouldn't say it's 'iPhonified' - the iPhone does some things quite well, but it also loses data when closing apps, has no background notifications, requires manually syncing contacts and calendar, has all icons the same shape, constantly selects text to copy when scrolling in Safari since firmware 3, and a few other choices I'm not willing to put up with anymore.

Re: The Android Opportunity

#139

Post by gonzo »

jacobian wrote: post #52
nuclear_eclipse wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

- Why do all eleventy-billion of my contacts show up in the dialer instead of the relatively small handful who've got phone numbers? Because the Dialer app is listing all of your contacts, because it serves as both the Dialer and the Contacts app all rolled into one. - Why the @#$% doesn't this thing have a proper headphone jack? Yell at HTC, not Android. - How do I sync music between my computer and my G1? Plug the…

That, my friends, is what's called "missing the forest for the trees." Yes, every single one of my question has an easy answer. Yup, just need to install this app or activate this hidden preference or tweak my Xorg.conf, or learn to live with the problem... Using this device is like the death of a thousand cuts. None are even remotely fatal, but over time there's just a mounting list of little annoyances. Everything'…

My 3G got stolen (out of my home). I have an ADP1, which I carried in France for 2 months this summer. (The ADP1 comes unlocked, so it was simple to get an Orange "Pay-as-you-Go" SIM and install it.

So I carried and used the ADP1 every day for two months (plus about a month during late March/early April before I switched back to my iPhone 2G with a cracked screen.)

yes, the ADP1 is running (the official) cupcake release.

Within 24 hours of arriving back home, I went out an bought an iPhone 3GS.

The usability of the combination of Android+HTC's Dream is pure crap. Its functional, sure, but its not usable.

I too stopped using linux on the desktop (I've converted the company to Apple over the last 2 years.) apt-get can screw you, too.

We do use linux on two production webservers, and we ship a ton (no really, at least 2,000 lbs) of FreeBSD on various hardware every month.

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