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The disappearance of Japan's animators

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Re: The disappearance of Japan's animators

#131
post #125

Teachers, nurses, game developers ... Companies get away with paying less because they can exploit the "passion" or intrinsic rewards that the jobs give

Teachers and nurses get paid poorly because in general voters do no want to be taxed. And these areas have low efficiency gains. Pretty similar ratio of workers to those taken care have stayed around for long time.

Re: The disappearance of Japan's animators

#132

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This isn’t banal for me! What’s a good headset for programming these days?

Ah my bad I probably created false hopes here but let me clarify : I program in VR for VR, and I help kids (and adults) learn programming thanks to VR. What I do NOT do is writing my bash scripts or things unrelated to VR in VR. I technically can but I just have so much tooling and habits outside of VR it wouldn't make sense. I'll answer your question as the end, you can skip to the last paragraph if you do not need…

A note on programming languages : you can program with any language in VR.

There are few languages that make it easier, e.g. JavaScript as in my case, or any other language with a VR library, e.g. Lua LÖVR or also tooling like Godot which does have an in-VR live reloading mode (sorry discussed in French only at https://video.benetou.fr/w/g111LSRGfj6HmNxa91au3q ).

If your favorite language isn't very convenient for VR you can get a WASM build via e.g. QEMU. If that's not practical you can get the heavy load in a container then communicate to it via ssh or a Web API.

My point being that you can program in any language in VR quite conveniently and the power of the device itself is typically not relevant. For example I started some simulation for swarm robotics from the HMD to explore the result in VR but the runs themselves where not done on the device.

TL;DR: your HMD can host everything or can be a thin terminal to your heavier workload.

Re: The disappearance of Japan's animators

#133

Earlier quoted context omitted.

At least the Frieren one was drawn by a single Japanese artist https://x.com/aoumemimei/status/2012695958824407124

I didn't realize that they redrew the parts that don't change between frames.

They don't usually. In this case they do because they need it to look jittery.

Re: The disappearance of Japan's animators

#134

Not everything is bleak. The ending sequence for Frieren season 2 was entirely hand drawn with colored pencils[0] and the new Ghost in the Shell (coming out next month) is also hand drawn[1]. [0] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FY4Bx2qtkRM [1] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nnRcKC4Rgsc

Frieren is fantastic and beautifully done, with only a few scenes that look cheap. But I actually strongly dislike the credit sequence you're talking about, and I'm pretty sure it's rotoscoped.

Re: The disappearance of Japan's animators

#135

Anime has never been more popular but honestly its quality has declined a lot. It's all isekai and supernatural-sexy-schoolgirl-whatever (kinda creepy) these days. Or the same old animes that go on forever. Every year there's less and less animes that are worth the time to watch IMHO.

What? This is a golden age of anime. You could count the number of anime available in the west and worth watching 25 years ago on one hand, maybe two. Now? If you can't find something, you're not looking hard enough. Off the top of my head, current anime that do not remotely fit your categories: - Spy x Family - Dandadan - Dungeon Meshi - Apocalypse Hotel - Yumi no Tsugai (Daemons of the Shadow Realm) - Kaiju No. 8 -…

To add a couple more into this list:

- Orb: On the Movements of the Earth

- Jaadugar: A Witch in Mongolia (upcoming)

Honestly, a lot of great anime fall into the cracks. Orb almost slipped me by, but that was a fantastic watch and I am eagerly anticipating Jaadugar.

edit: one more I couldn't help but add: Uma Musume: Cinderella Gray. Just let go of what you may feel about having a story centered around horse-girl hybrids, ultimately Cingray is a fantastic female-led shounen sports anime.

Re: The disappearance of Japan's animators

#136
post #103

Not everything is bleak. The ending sequence for Frieren season 2 was entirely hand drawn with colored pencils[0] and the new Ghost in the Shell (coming out next month) is also hand drawn[1]. [0] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FY4Bx2qtkRM [1] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nnRcKC4Rgsc

So for new Ghost in the Shell is it a good idea to watch previous ones before watching the new one? If so, it what order? Is movie worth watching at all?

I can also recommend the manga, the first vol. It's packed with interesting ideas and author footnotes that the 1995 hints at but has no time to elaborate on.

E.g. In the movie the protagonist glances an office worker that looks like her. The manga has her explain that she looks like a cheap generic model to hide the fact she is full of expensive specialized government tech. I always think of that scene when I put an expensive work laptop in a ratty backpack.

Re: The disappearance of Japan's animators

#137
post #96

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I wonder why the use of AI to do in-between frames is not more embraced by artists and professionals. It's been being used for years. It saves time, but ultimately the results aren't good enough to replace humans. I don't expect that it ever will be. AI is incapable of creativity and sometimes it'll be faster and easier for an artist to just draw what they envision than it is to tell a computer what they want, have…

The heavy lifting in terms of realizing vision was already done in the design, layout, and keyframing phases. The in-between frames are interpolations, that's why they're sent to sweatshops. And the idea is that you wouldn't proompt them like you do Midjourney; you'd send the AI keyframes and it would geberste the in-betweens. I can totally see where an animator might be dissatisfied with doing this on a hand-drawn p…

People are not going to understand my generic reincarnation harem anime if it doesn't involve Koreans working 120+h weeks for minimum wage.

Just the staggering amount of anime produced these days blows my mind.

One could die of overwork just binge watching them.

Re: The disappearance of Japan's animators

#138

Hey, hi, yoohoo whistles . Everyone gather 'round and reread this part: Lacking proper training and a viable salary, many young animators don’t feel they can keep going. The Japan Research Institute estimated that a quarter of them quit the industry within four years, and two-thirds in eight years. This retention problem has often been viewed as a form of natural selection. “I think this way of thinking is misguided,…

I worked with CNC machining shops in Sweden and the people working there made the exact same points. CNC is not exactly an art form, but programming the machines definitely has some craftsmanship aspects to it. Even considering that after a part is programmed it can then be mass produced.

- Very hard to get young people in because entry level pays very poorly AND requires non-trivial amounts of training.

- Razor-thin margins so shops can't afford to pay well

- Overall not great work conditions compared to an office job

- Retiring experienced older workforce with no one to replace them

- Having a shop in China machine the parts for you can be quite acceptable, especially in higher volumes

However I disagree with your argument of "obsession with [...] only ever hiring the 10xer". It is not so much that, but rather that if you hire average people with average skills or people that require training *you go out of business* because the shop next door won't.

Basically it drains the expertise completely dry until is just completely moves to another country having a demographic boom. And this is happening to software engineering right now. People who complain about immigration don't seem to realize that non-developed countries are seeing massive population growth reductions too.

Eventually the world is going to run out of countries having demographic booms, then society will have a massive lack of people to maintain existing infrastructure and corporations. The only upside is that wealth inequality should drastically reduce in this scenario (unless some governments manage to push caste systems back into fashion).

Re: The disappearance of Japan's animators

#139

Hey, hi, yoohoo whistles . Everyone gather 'round and reread this part: Lacking proper training and a viable salary, many young animators don’t feel they can keep going. The Japan Research Institute estimated that a quarter of them quit the industry within four years, and two-thirds in eight years. This retention problem has often been viewed as a form of natural selection. “I think this way of thinking is misguided,…

I worked with CNC machining shops in Sweden and the people working there made the exact same points. CNC is not exactly an art form, but programming the machines definitely has some craftsmanship aspects to it. Even considering that after a part is programmed it can then be mass produced. - Very hard to get young people in because entry level pays very poorly AND requires non-trivial amounts of training. - Razor-thin…

>It is not so much that, but rather that if you hire average people with average skills or people that require training you go out of business because the shop next door won't.

If only workers would form some kind of a community, which would take monthly contributions and that would then be used to upskill. It would unite most, if not all people in the same industry.

Re: The disappearance of Japan's animators

#140
post #98
post #94

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> As ever, if you want to know where much of the expertise has gone, look to China (and South Korea) Good news! You don't need to worry about that anymore! I can guarantee you, as the article implies, money from big tech is being funneled to people perfecting models for in-betweeners as we speak. /s I think we may be entering an era where we really have to start thinking about how to organize work at a fundamental le…

> we really have to start thinking about how to organize work at a fundamental level Who is this "we"? As if society at large gets a say? Do people owning land and houses ask the homeless of how to organize home ownership?

All it takes is a populist with a good message to make a political group. All functional Western nations have voting mechanisms that allow for radical government change, if there is enough public support for it. It might take a decade to fully manifest, but if we're entering an age of such extreme, then I would expect people to eventually vote for such change.
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