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A.I. note takers are making lawyers nervous

nytimes.com

131–140 of 204 posts

Re: A.I. note takers are making lawyers nervous

#131
post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> If they miss a word they never do unintelligible, they just start playing madlibs based on the rest of the sentence. Imo this is the single biggest flaw of LLMs. They're great at a lot of things, but knowing when they're wrong (or don't have enough information to actually work on) is a critical flaw. IMO there's nothing structural about why they shouldn't be able to spot this and correct themselves - I suspect it's…

I don't think it's a training issue, it's simply that there's no inherent "I don't know" in the transformer architecture unless it's really like something completely unknown, otherwise the nearest neighbor will be chosen and that will be whatever sounds similar or is relevant, even if it might cause a problem

I feel like if you trained better for "I don't know", it would drag down competence everywhere else somehow. Like, the strength of a model is exactly it's ability to grasp at straws and very often find the right one.

If you ask a good model something that makes no sense, it will tell you it makes no sense and it can't answer the question; so I know it's possible.

Re: A.I. note takers are making lawyers nervous

#133
post #92

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not the person who said this, but it's easy: Grow up in a country where the government listening in is common (without any transparent due process), and it becomes second nature. And then add to that how easy it is to record phone conversations with today's phones (I've done it), it's easier on the brain to assume it's being recorded as opposed to wondering if it is. But yes, I don't care about my dirty jokes being r…

Not necessarily. Snowden has proven the US intelligence agencies can basically intercept anyone's electronic communications, and that they do this is a giant scale. And yet, we still see comments of people horrified when you said you assume as default that someone (or more likley, something) is listening. The normalcy bias is too strong.

I'm not horrified that they think someone is listening, the horror was from them self censoring out of fear of surveillance.

Re: A.I. note takers are making lawyers nervous

#134

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Even today, I generally assume that my phone could be tapped; even when talking with my trusted work colleagues, friends, and family. I'm extra careful about dirty jokes or "grey morality" in video conferences and email. This is horrifying. Why do you feel the necessity to self-censor? What consequences do you anticipate?

Have you missed the last decade and a half of people having their lives ruined by social media mobs for minor slights?

By their friends or government agents recording telephone conversations where they say an off-color joke?

Re: A.I. note takers are making lawyers nervous

#135
post #47

Back when I was in college, in a fraternity, we always assumed that the phones were tapped. Specifically, we never spoke about alcohol or marijuana (now legal) on the phone. Even today, I generally assume that my phone could be tapped; even when talking with my trusted work colleagues, friends, and family. I'm extra careful about dirty jokes or "grey morality" in video conferences and email. The same applies to speak…

It just seems so unhealthy to live in a low-trust society. Is there a way out?

Maybe AI agents that work in our personal best interests?

Re: A.I. note takers are making lawyers nervous

#136

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Plus they are super inaccurate. Gemini gets one of its three bullet subtly or very majorly wrong almost every time. Just a few weeks ago Gemini said we’re rolling out our payment setup in Russia. You know the place where we have 20+ sanctions packages on? We were talking about France in the meeting.

We've found they're surprisingly good if everyone on the call is using a decent headset. The problems start when using conference room audio or someone is on their laptop mic. If they miss a word they never do unintelligible , they just start playing madlibs based on the rest of the sentence. We just went through a round of 100+ (non-sensitive) VoC interviews and they really cut down the workload of compiling all of…

"This technology works as long as you're not a pleb"

Re: A.I. note takers are making lawyers nervous

#137
post #76
post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think it's a training issue, it's simply that there's no inherent "I don't know" in the transformer architecture unless it's really like something completely unknown, otherwise the nearest neighbor will be chosen and that will be whatever sounds similar or is relevant, even if it might cause a problem

The final output of the neural network part of an LLM is a vector with weights for every token, that is then usually softmaxed and picked from. Can we not quantify the uncertainty by looking at the distribution of weights of the top 10 options? Like we expect for a note-taking app that the top choice would be something like 98% certain, and if we see that the model gives a weight of 60% to "Russia" and 30% to "France…

Unfortunately, that likely just doesn't exist. Everything suggests that these models are confident about their mistakes.

Re: A.I. note takers are making lawyers nervous

#138
post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You’d use a computer generated transcript as a guide, not as proof - the proof is the recording of the person actually saying the thing, not the LLMs best guess of what it imagined the person saying. “At timestamp X, person Y said Z” says the robot, and then you dutifully scrub the audio to timestamp X to verify.

Is audio always kept in addition to transcripts? (genuine question, I rarely record either)

At least in Microsoft Teams transcription and recording are separate options.

Re: A.I. note takers are making lawyers nervous

#139

In business communication of every kind, voice, text, emails, paper sticky-notes, doesn't matter. Assume someone is sharing your information with someone that you don't know is sharing it. Communicate as if you have an audience at all times. Also, I am not a lawyer, but the error rates are too high for anything transcribed to stand up in court with a good lawyer, unless corroborated by human witnesses.

you are talking management level intelligence to a very Individual Contributor crowd. People will nuke every opportunity presented to them in their life in defense of NDAs that don't matter - better called Not Doing Anythings.

Re: A.I. note takers are making lawyers nervous

#140
post #47

Back when I was in college, in a fraternity, we always assumed that the phones were tapped. Specifically, we never spoke about alcohol or marijuana (now legal) on the phone. Even today, I generally assume that my phone could be tapped; even when talking with my trusted work colleagues, friends, and family. I'm extra careful about dirty jokes or "grey morality" in video conferences and email. The same applies to speak…

> I'm extra careful about dirty jokes or "grey morality" in video conferences and email.

That's a good policy when interacting with any human or device in a work context.

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