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I'm Kenyan. I don't write like ChatGPT, ChatGPT writes like me

marcusolang.substack.com

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Re: I'm Kenyan. I don't write like ChatGPT, ChatGPT writes like me

#131

Post by 0xbadcafebee »

It's pretty rude to "accuse" someone of using AI. Would you yell "Dictionary!", "Grammarly!", "Reference manual!", "Newspaper quote!" at them? Maybe "Harvard!" or "Tutored!" ? You don't know who they are or what their life is like. Maybe they're blind and using it as an assisted device. Maybe their hand is injured and they use it to output information faster. Maybe they're old, infirm, a non-native English speaker, etc. Maybe they're just a regular person who feels insecure writing, and wants to use new technology to give them the confidence to write/comment more. Or, maybe they just talk like that.

Let's say you happen to be lucky, don't accuse someone unfairly, and they are using ChatGPT to write what they said. Who cares?! What is it you're doing by "calling them out" ? Winning internet points? Feeling superior? Fixing the world?

Re: I'm Kenyan. I don't write like ChatGPT, ChatGPT writes like me

#132

Post by lapcat »

twoodfin wrote: post #116
lapcat wrote: post #79

False accusations of AI writing are becoming absurd and infuriating. The other day I saw and argued with this accusation by a HN commenter against a professional writer, based on the most tenuous shred of evidence: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=46255049

[flagged]

> My friend

We're not friends.

> the article whose provenance you are defending is clearly LLM-“punched up” at a minimum.

I'm not even going to ask for your evidence, because the previous argument I had was a frustrating waste of time that ended with insane reality denial by the other party: "Textbooks don't contain section headers every few paragraphs." https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=46256470

I encourage you to read through the entire argument, though, and see how the AI accuser makes false empirical claims and generalizations at every step, constantly moving the goalposts whenever I presented disproof.

Re: I'm Kenyan. I don't write like ChatGPT, ChatGPT writes like me

#133

Post by Kim_Bruning »

Yizahi wrote: post #117

While author is correct in general, I would like to add a counter-point regarding em-dashes specifically. Yes, many people use them like this - and many website frameworks will automatically replace a keyboard not-really-a-minus symbol with em-dash. So that is not a sign of the LLM generated slop. What LLMs also do though, is use em-dashes like this (imagine that "--" is an em-dash here): "So, when you read my work--…

It could also—hear me out here—be me just using compose + --- .

(Not that I used n- or m- dash previously, I used commas, like this! )

But some people learn n- and m-dash, it turns out. Who knew!

Re: I'm Kenyan. I don't write like ChatGPT, ChatGPT writes like me

#134

Post by rcarmo »

dismantlethesun wrote: post #5

Ironically OpenAI used Kenyan workers[1] to train its AI and now we've come to the point where Kenyans are being excluded because they sound too much like the AI that they helped train. [1] https://time.com/6247678/openai-chatgpt-kenya-workers/

I actually think that's a great endorsement of Kenyan education. I don't deal with English-speaking African countries that often (I'm Portuguese, so naturally we have ties to other bits of the continent), but I've often been impressed by how well they communicate regardless of the profession they're in--I don't mean that as a bias, but rather as it befitting the kind of conversation you'd have with an English major in the UK (to which I have a lot of exposure).

Perhaps the US-centric "optimization" of English is to blame here, since it is so obvious in regular US media we all consume across the planet, and is likely the contrasting style.

Re: I'm Kenyan. I don't write like ChatGPT, ChatGPT writes like me

#135

Post by rcarmo »

BalinKing wrote: post #130
yokoprime wrote: post #120

The author uses dash (-) not em dash (—), there is a big difference in that everyone has a dedicated dash/undersocore key on their keyboard, but nobody has a em dash key. You can use word processing software etc, but using em dash consistently throughout a text is very unnatural in casual written texts.

There is an easy shortcut for em dashes on macOS, Opt+Shift+-. This makes it really easy to use them, which I do all the time in casual settings (indeed, more often than in formal settings).

Autocomplete does that for me (bilingual English/Portuguese).

Re: I'm Kenyan. I don't write like ChatGPT, ChatGPT writes like me

#136

Post by guerrilla »

neffy wrote: post #100
guerrilla wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> They said nigerian but there may be a common way English is taught in the entire area. Nigeria and Kenya are two very different regions with different spheres of business. I don't know, but I wouldn't expect the English to overlap that much.

There are a lot of very distinctive versions of English floating around after the British Empire, Indian newspapers are particularly delightful that way - but there is as the author says, an inherited common educational system dating back to the colonial period, which has probably created a fairly common "educated dialect" abroad, just as it has between all the local accents and dialects back in the motherland.

That's not a very good argument, because then you could say the same for American, Canada, South Africa, Australia and so on. If recency is an issue, then here's a list of colonies that got their freedom around the same time:

Cyprus, Somalia, Sierra Leone, Kuwait, Tanzania, Jamaica, Trinidad and Tobago, Uganda, Kenya, Malawi, Zambia, Malta, Gambia, Guyana, Botswana, Lesotho, Barbados, Yemen, Mauritius, Eswatini (Swaziland).

If what you're saying is right then you'd have to admit Jamaican and Barbados English are just the same as Kenyan or Nigerian... but they're not. They're radically different because they're radically different regions. Uganda and Kenya being similar is what I would expect, but not necessarily Nigeria...

Re: I'm Kenyan. I don't write like ChatGPT, ChatGPT writes like me

#137

Post by rcarmo »

checker659 wrote: post #22

Bang on. The self proclaimed detectives have never had to take TOEFL where you'll get marks deducted for not using connectors like furthermore.

Goodness, I forgot about TOEFL. That might indeed shape a lot of your early vocabulary choices if you need to get an English certificate (which I suppose would happen during college years, which is also when most of your personal writing style gels together).

Re: I'm Kenyan. I don't write like ChatGPT, ChatGPT writes like me

#138

Post by JumpCrisscross »

lo_zamoyski wrote: post #114
komali2 wrote: post #80

> There were unspoken rules, commandments passed down from teacher to student, year after year. The first commandment? Thou shalt begin with a proverb or a powerful opening statement. “Haste makes waste,” we would write, before launching into a tale about rushing to the market and forgetting the money. The second? Thou shalt demonstrate a wide vocabulary. You didn’t just ‘walk’; you ‘strode purposefully’, ‘trudged we…

> the deeper I got into the world of literature, the further I was pushed towards simpler language and shorter sentences Language is like clothing. Those with no taste - but enough money - will dress in gaudy ways to show off their wealth. The clothing is merely a vector for this purpose. They won’t use a piece of jewelry only if it contributes to the ensemble. Oh, no. They’ll drape themselves with gold chains and fe…

> Language is like clothing. Those with no taste - but enough money - will dress in gaudy ways to show off their wealth

You got the first bit right. Language and clothing accord to fashions.

What counts as gaudy versus grounded, discreet versus disrespectful—this turns on moving cultural values. And those at the top implicitly benefit from this drift, which lets us dismiss as gaudy someone wearing a classic hand-me-down who isn’t clued into a hoodie and jeans being the surfer’s English to Nairobi’s formality.

(Spiced food was held in high regard in ancient Rome and Medieval European courts. Until spices became plentiful. Then the focus shifted "to emphasize ingredients’ natural flavors" [1]. A similar shift happened as post-War America got rich. Canned plenty and fully-stocked pantries made way for farm-to-table freshness and simple seasonings. And now, we're swinging back towards fuller spice cabinets as a mark of global taste.)

[1] https://historyfacts.com/world-history/article/how-did-salt-...

Re: I'm Kenyan. I don't write like ChatGPT, ChatGPT writes like me

#139

Post by nottorp »

SSLy wrote: post #126
nottorp wrote: post #112

Earlier quoted context omitted.

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=46264955 No, don't think so. To compensate, I probably missed the article about the obfuscation of kindle ebooks...

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=45610226

Hmm 2 months ago. Now I wonder if the link you posted inspired the link I posted...

Re: I'm Kenyan. I don't write like ChatGPT, ChatGPT writes like me

#140

Post by elzbardico »

oneeyedpigeon wrote: post #61
lm28469 wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I know someone who was camping in a tent next to a river during a storm, took a pic of the stream and asked chatgpt if it was risky to sleep there given that it "rained a lot" ... People are unplugging their brains and are not even aware that their questions cannot be answered by llms, I witnessed that with smart and educated people, I can't imagine how bad it's going to be during formative years

Sam Altman literally said he didn't know how anyone could raise a baby without using a chatbot. We're living in some very weird times right now.

We should refrain from the common mistake of anthropomorphizing Sam Altman.
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