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On loyalty to your employer (2018)

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Re: On loyalty to your employer (2018)

#131

Post by peepee1982 »

closewith wrote: post #38
CharlieDigital wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Work" here I would define as exchanging time for money. Volunteering is not work. For me personally, I make a distinction between "working" and "creating". I will always want to create (a very broad term), but I will not always want to work. In fact, I don't want to work now; I only want to create. The best is when I can exchange my creation for money -- then it is no longer work.

No, work is effort expended to achieve a result. Whether it's paid or not is irrelevant, and many people work harder for free than they ever do in employment, because the incentives are right.

This is a useless definition, especially in this context. Washing my dishes is not work, because it's ultimately irrelevant whether I do it or not, although I'm doing it still because I have a result in mind.

It also comes across as very out of touch and privileged, because unless you have a relatively cushy job, you would definitely not see the difference between being paid or not as irrelevant. There are plenty of people who have to work very hard just to make ends meet, be it physically exhausting work, or repetitive and monotonous work. And they will not have the capacity to work even harder once they clock out of work, no matter the incentives, because they'll be spent and unable to.

Re: On loyalty to your employer (2018)

#132

Post by thunky »

Scene_Cast2 wrote: post #113
rckt wrote: post #103

I got it pretty early in my career that loyalty for a company is concept to make you work harder without asking anything in return. And the moment the company shifts focus and you are out of it, then suddenly you understand that this loyalty wasn't kind of a credits account which you've been saving all this time. It's simply nothing. You are on your own and can fuck off. So there's simply no place for loyalty in empl…

Employer? No. But I've seen some very smart coworkers value and reward deep, specialized knowledge that is built through working in the same area (of not just tech but also business application) for many years.

That's experience, which has nothing to do with loyalty.

Re: On loyalty to your employer (2018)

#133

Post by RankingMember »

geodel wrote: post #120
TimPC wrote: post #89

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think it depends a lot on your finances though. If you come from a rich family and have parental support by all means it is amazing to travel young. But if your travel budget is coming out of your downpayment on your house that could easily be the difference between buying before house prices got out of control or not. For example if you could have bought in 2013 without travel and it takes you till 2015 to save up…

After reading a bit if history on travel/tourism I understood that this whole travel thing itself used to be luxury, upperclass thing. Most people would work and live where they are born, visit a few times in life outside for religious purpose or to attend important/relative's wedding etc. And that's about it. For myself I didn't travel much for leisure when I was young, I am not traveling when I am middle aged and h…

Different strokes I guess! I will say that there's something unique I get from travelling that I don't get from anything else- the visceral in-person reminder that people are, at their core, very similar everywhere- mostly decent people just living their lives. It's like an antidote to the "other"-ing that sometimes creeps into the psyche from our media landscape.

Re: On loyalty to your employer (2018)

#134

Post by wonderwonder »

I have found that in the age of work from home its increasingly difficult to have any loyalty or community with the people I work with. Been in my current company for ~4 years and I just feel nothing for them. The pay is good so I work hard. Other than that, 90% of my co-workers are off shore so I have almost no interaction with them aside from a 2 hour or so overlap in the morning. Couldn't tell you what most of their names are or what they do. They are just a series of letters sending me teams messages asking me for help or to work on a ticket.

The entire thing is a black box. I put work in and I get money out.

Re: On loyalty to your employer (2018)

#135

Post by inkcapmushroom »

CharlieDigital wrote: post #9
sandworm101 wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not everyone has the money to swim with whales or explore jungles. And even among the few that do, many would rather spend thier money on uplifting other people than self-indulgent ecotourism. Many would rather work until they die in full knowledge that doing so might help free thier children from work altogether. And a fair number still see productive work as a greater good than sloth or vanity.

You can go hike the Appalachian Trail for free. Explore national parks for a nominal fee. Explore the sights and sounds of your nearest city without much cost at all.

Not sure if you meant hiking the whole AT or not, but thru-hiking the AT costs an estimated $1k per month (most thru-hikers take 5-7 months and spend about 5-7 grand). Equipment, food, occasional lodging and doing nice things on the way, and you'll still likely have to be paying all your normal expenses while you're doing it.

Re: On loyalty to your employer (2018)

#136

Post by hamburglar »

CharlieDigital wrote: post #4

> “When I’m on my deathbed, I won’t look back at my life and wish I had worked harder. I’ll look back and wish I spent more time with the people I loved.” I saw a Reddit thread the other day on r/startups or r/entrepreneur where the OP was talking about how they'll be working until the day he or she dies. I immediately wondered if this individual had a family, friends. Had this person already seen the world and its m…

I retired last year. Decided I’ve got enough money to last me the rest of my life if I live reasonably, and that’s good enough for me. I have a 40 hour a week job doing development, but it’s a passion project that I’m doing purely for enjoyment (and I’m working completely for equity). I felt my life instantly get easier the moment I quit my old job. It’s conceivable that this job will make me a pile of money, but I know it isn’t likely. I see my kids a lot more, I take time off when I need it, and I still feel like I’m doing something useful. I have decided that this is truly the way to live.

Re: On loyalty to your employer (2018)

#137

Post by chii »

kjellsbells wrote: post #51

Even if you are content at your job, there are risks in staying for very long periods of time. If you've ever joined an org where key people have been there for decades then you'll know of the immense amount of interior knowledge that these folks have. At best, they become instituional memories of the org, at worst, a cabal. The worst case is obvious: you can't get anything done barring their approval, and as a newbi…

> what happens when WidgetCorp lays you off?

While you're at widgetcorp, make your name known in the industry as the expert of widgets. Essentially, it's a sort of public portfilio. Surely, there are widgetcorp competitors out there, which if they get wind of your immenent layoff, might take a bet at hiring you. Not to mention you might be able to poach the other members of widgetcorp as an entire team.

Re: On loyalty to your employer (2018)

#138

Post by zelon88 »

CharlieDigital wrote: post #4

> “When I’m on my deathbed, I won’t look back at my life and wish I had worked harder. I’ll look back and wish I spent more time with the people I loved.” I saw a Reddit thread the other day on r/startups or r/entrepreneur where the OP was talking about how they'll be working until the day he or she dies. I immediately wondered if this individual had a family, friends. Had this person already seen the world and its m…

A lifetime is a long time. Viewpoints, opinions, standpoints, circumstances and plans rarely last a lifetime.

Re: On loyalty to your employer (2018)

#139

Post by geodel »

markus_zhang wrote: post #114
CharlieDigital wrote: post #4

> “When I’m on my deathbed, I won’t look back at my life and wish I had worked harder. I’ll look back and wish I spent more time with the people I loved.” I saw a Reddit thread the other day on r/startups or r/entrepreneur where the OP was talking about how they'll be working until the day he or she dies. I immediately wondered if this individual had a family, friends. Had this person already seen the world and its m…

I always think this is very biased. Basically there are two things to consider: 1. People at deathbed usually don't think very clearly, and it suggests the deathbed experience overrules everything before 2. Many people just have work. They don't have a calling, and neither do they have a career. It does sound reasonable to drop work for something else, as long as money is fine.

Excellent points.

Considering I have heard these "Deathbed Quotes" so many times with similar sounding refrain I am just inclined to ignore them.

And most people I know and see do drop work for family and friends ever so often as much their situation permits.

Re: On loyalty to your employer (2018)

#140

Post by francisofascii »

catmanjan wrote: post #104
k__ wrote: post #87

You should be loyal to your craft, not to your employer. You might have a job as a developer at some company that could get terminated at any time. Your skills and reputation remain irrespectively.

What about the loyal loom operators?

I am guessing some of those loom operators transitioned to mending and patching, and operating the new machines. Guessing we will do the same. Just not all of us will make it.
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