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Telegram founder Pavel Durov arrested at French airport

theguardian.com

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Re: Telegram founder Pavel Durov arrested at French airport

#131

Post by skyyler »

Oras wrote: post #21
codedokode wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Telegram has public and private groups. They probably want to jail him for not pre-moderating every posted message.

That’s my question, if messages are end to end encrypted then the company does not have access to censor, right?

The messages are not end to end encrypted.

There is a feature that can be enabled to create an end-to-end encrypted chat between strictly two users, but most people do not actually use it.

Telegram is largely a social network masquerading as a messaging app. There is a deep network of “channels” that interlink with each other to provide a community for users. None of that is encrypted.

Re: Telegram founder Pavel Durov arrested at French airport

#132

Post by llm_trw »

ProAm wrote: post #106
mmsc wrote: post #82

Just think: all the companies that do illegal shit and get slaps on the wrist with a few thousand/million dollar fines. That's the only "consequence" for the executives that blew up the economy in 2008, the politicians that are in cahoots with company executives to funnel money into their pockets, the companies that spy on their own employees without due diligence or cause, the producers of products that knowingly ca…

We can be honest and the government realizes that it's not just talking. At least for the conversations they are concerned about. *EDIT* I dont agree with it, but Ive seen governments do far worse with far less.

And you can send encrypted SD cards through the mail.

Arrest all postwomen.

Re: Telegram founder Pavel Durov arrested at French airport

#133

Post by IncandescentGas »

gtvwill wrote: post #66
thamer wrote: post #40

From the article, that's a massive pile of charges they're dumping onto him, all apparently because people use Telegram in ways the French state disapproves of? > Why was he under threat of a search warrant? > The justice department considers that the lack of moderation, lack of cooperation with law enforcement, and the tools offered by Telegram (disposable number, cryptocurrencies, etc.) make him an accomplice to dr…

Well of you provide a service and it's knowingly used by criminals and you just implement features to benefit the criminal activity but make no effort to curb it. Yes, your an accomplice.

Would you arrest a road worker because the highway onramp they just repaved was used by bank robbers to flee the scene of the crime?

Re: Telegram founder Pavel Durov arrested at French airport

#135

Post by qayxc »

k1ndl1 wrote: post #64

Durov has a French passport, so he will be charged as a French citizen. What is weird is that he sure knew that he was on the watchlist in France, though he has chosen to go there. Why?

Hybris. Some people once they have reached a certain level of status and wealth see themselves as untouchable.

Re: Telegram founder Pavel Durov arrested at French airport

#136

Post by gtvwill »

chad1n wrote: post #92
gtvwill wrote: post #83

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well much like the owner of omegle found out you can't provide platforms for criminal activities and make no effort to curb it. It only takes a 30 second google before you find telegram rooms offering all kinds of illegal stuff. You don't find that on Twitter. Twitter is atleast mildly moderated. Telegram could have moderation built in to catch illegal activities but it chooses to do nothing. See the difference?

Telegram is end-to-end encrypted in private chats, the Telegram team doesn't even know what people are discussing. Same should happen with Whatsapp or Signal. Should Whatsapp or Signal be accountable for what terrorists talk in private?

App can have internal keyword check that could open backdoor to law enforcement when certain terms are said. *fbi enters the conversation* probably won't be in your chat log anytime soon but you can't argue telegram, signal and whatsapp can't do it. Whatsapp being fbs darling almost certainly does already and signal servers anti spam folder is smelling mighty like a five eyes backdoor.

Tbh given both those apps company's have dealings with gov in aus I'm gonna say signals probably already got a backdoor into em. If you don't think so you don't know aus law well enough or who signals are.

Also the owners of the apps aren't liable for the content of the conversations. Their liable for providing a platform for the conversation to take place and for not knowingly taking available efforts to curb criminal activity on that platfor/service. It's like hey I'm gonna rent you a store house to hide all your illegal drugs in Mr gang member. I'm not doing the hiding or anything but I'm assisting the activity by providing the store house. I could make efforts to curb such activity like you know doing a rental inspection once every six months but I choose not to and turn a blind eye. Am I assisting a crime or am I completely innocent? Now repeat this but telegram is the store house.

Re: Telegram founder Pavel Durov arrested at French airport

#137

Post by k1ndl1 »

aquatica wrote: post #91
greatgib wrote: post #2

I did not see the info anywhere else, but it was just broadcasted by the main French tv channel. Pavel Durov, the Telegram founder was just arrested out of his airplane in the Bourget airport in France near Paris. There is no info about why exactly he was arrested but it looks like that French police had a warrant for him. But it looks like it is because that he is accused of being an accessory of a lot of things lik…

> "I can easily guess that assholes in secret service would probably like very much to use that to blackmail him to add backdoors to telegram. So sad." Telegram is a backdoor by design. The server has complete access to all your messages, they can do whatever they want with those. And they even had a backdoor in E2EE chats, see: https://habr.com/ru/articles/206900/

This was a bug that was fixed right after it was reported. The author of the article praised Telegram for the speed of reaction.

Re: Telegram founder Pavel Durov arrested at French airport

#139

Post by gmueckl »

greatgib wrote: post #2

I did not see the info anywhere else, but it was just broadcasted by the main French tv channel. Pavel Durov, the Telegram founder was just arrested out of his airplane in the Bourget airport in France near Paris. There is no info about why exactly he was arrested but it looks like that French police had a warrant for him. But it looks like it is because that he is accused of being an accessory of a lot of things lik…

That is absolutely not how it works. If you offer a platform for public discourse you are required by law to moderate it or face the consequences. Telegram group chats are technically open to moderation, yet the company has done nothing to put any kind of moderation in place.

This is in contrast to Facebook or Twitter. Those platforms will absolutely take down content that is offensive or criminal in nature.

Re: Telegram founder Pavel Durov arrested at French airport

#140

Post by artembugara »

abcd_f wrote: post #123
artembugara wrote: post #26

According to this source he’s accused in non-cooperating. He’s not accused of terrorism, drug, or slaving directly. Very interesting to see where it will all go. I don’t understand how they’re going to convince French judges that he’s guilty for not being able to decrypt chats that he has no keys for…

> According to this source he’s accused in non-cooperating. With the context that you omitted it makes more sense: Justice considers that the absence of moderation, cooperation with law enforcement and the tools offered by Telegram (disposable numbers, cryptocurrencies...) makes it an accomplice to drug trafficking, pedo-criminal offenses and swindling.

Yes you’re correct.
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