I came across this shortly before beginning my degree in music and it completely changed how I approached learning new pieces. When I tried to explain the technique to another pianist, they were confused as to what was 'new' about it. I guess they never had a teacher say "play it over and over until you can play it without mistakes". Now, my wife is completing her education degree and I see a lot of this approach bei…
I find it hard to believe a pianist (or any trained musician) has never heard of playing something over and over again without mistakes...
Fundamentals of Piano Practice
131–140 of 201 posts
Re: Fundamentals of Piano Practice
#132Does this book cover how to figure out finger numbering for sheet music that doesn't have finger numbering? By finger numbering I mean the standard scheme where thumb=1, index=2, ..., pinky=5, and the notes on the sheet music have these numbers. This is the biggest mystery to me. I understand there is not a One True Canonical Fingering for a given sequence of notes. But some fingerings make the music much easier than…
>Wish some HN coder genius would write a program that given sheet music as input, outputs the top 1-3 recommended fingerings for that music with explanations for which rules were applied. While I am NOT claiming to be "some coder genius", a program that does exactly this is something on my "projects to-do" list. My partner (who's improving her piano skills) keeps crying out for more sheet music with fingerings... Is…
My personal interest was more along the lines of acquiring statistical data from expert play. I'm supremely interested in this problem from a mathematical standpoint, but the data-set did not exist and I shelved the project as I'm a novice player.
I don't think the data-set would be very hard or very expensive to construct, given several experts and a program to generate note sequences. One could also sample from a large population of players, but then you have the bootstrap problem of attracting them before you offer enough value.
There are some very promising pathways for this developing if you're interested in the statistical approach. In any case I'd love to keep up with your project if you continue on.
Re: Fundamentals of Piano Practice
#133Earlier quoted context omitted.
The fingerings in the example in the readme are completely non-intuitive for me. I've played piano for a few years and never encountered such fingering. My guess is that the algorithm is optimizing for the wrong metric.
What particular fingering looks odd to you? The only one I see, for the Invention in D, is basically the same as what's given in the Alfred edition of the inventions (and the Henle, and others...).
I hope the internet won't become flooded with sheet music that has bad auto-generated fingering, because it's something that you really trust. If I encounter some strange fingering I trust that the composer knew something that I don't that I maybe should work hard to apply to my own technique, obviously this will damage your technique if it's nonsensical.
Re: Fundamentals of Piano Practice
#134Have to chime-in here as a piano player since age 7 (so been going for ~28 now), who about 2 years ago got very serious about Jazz. I have stumbled across this book many times, I have read it. It's the single most controversial book that I've read about piano technique and playing that I've found. The author, is not even a player himself (!!!). There's a great summary of reviews about the book here ( https://www.pian…
Can I ask you what your path into jazz has been like? I've been playing myself for like 25 years, classically trained for my whole childhood. I've always enjoyed improvisation and love jazz piano so much, but I've found it really hard to build from my very limited improv vocabulary into "serious" jazz, and I've had a hard time learning how to learn jazz, if that makes sense.
[1]: https://www.amazon.com/Jazz-Piano-Book-Mark-Levine/dp/096147...
Re: Fundamentals of Piano Practice
#135Have to chime-in here as a piano player since age 7 (so been going for ~28 now), who about 2 years ago got very serious about Jazz. I have stumbled across this book many times, I have read it. It's the single most controversial book that I've read about piano technique and playing that I've found. The author, is not even a player himself (!!!). There's a great summary of reviews about the book here ( https://www.pian…
Can I ask you what your path into jazz has been like? I've been playing myself for like 25 years, classically trained for my whole childhood. I've always enjoyed improvisation and love jazz piano so much, but I've found it really hard to build from my very limited improv vocabulary into "serious" jazz, and I've had a hard time learning how to learn jazz, if that makes sense.
Basically I'd say there are 3 parts in learning improvisation: the theoretical part (which is already a complex one because there are several possible theoretical approaches to jazz improvisation), the imitation part (learn and play back existing phrases, or better complete solos from the masters), the by-ear / singing part (the toughest one that most actually don't reach, at least reliably).
Don't forget that there is definitely a large social part in jazz improvisation; I'd rate my improvisation ability as uninteresting most of the time; I can get "in the zone" accidentally by myself, but more often it's a band thing: playing with the right people often enough and long enough to get together in "the zone". Yes, that's exactly the same zone as the programming one; you're lost in the music, feeling what's coming next and what notes should be played by whom (there only comes your technical ability in the picture) without thinking about it.
In my personal case, a long practice of classical piano hampered my early capability at improvisation for a long time and I needed the crutch of theory, and to intellectualize the process. Some blessed people "ear" the right notes without needing any justification "why" they are the right ones.
When you've got a long practice of your instrument, the difficulty is to free yourself from the reassuring but useless knowledge and habits you have that bring you to play this scale or this phrase because it's "in your fingers". The best way to reach that point is to have hundreds of ready phrases in all tones "in your fingers", and then try to forget them and listen to the music. Hopefully, you'll feel what goes where, like an unrolling, animated puzzle, or a Tetris game.
Personally I've found Kent Hewitt's advice to be very useful, I think it may help a lot of people. What's great in his playing is that he keeps it very simple, but always richly melodic. https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCdmjw5sm9Kn83TB_rA_QBCw
Another piece of advice I can give you is to learn to recognize chords and all the different ways they're built (by stacking thirds or fourths, etc) and how they come in succession (the usual II V I VI and friends) to get a better feel of what comes here or there.
Re: Fundamentals of Piano Practice
#136Have to chime-in here as a piano player since age 7 (so been going for ~28 now), who about 2 years ago got very serious about Jazz. I have stumbled across this book many times, I have read it. It's the single most controversial book that I've read about piano technique and playing that I've found. The author, is not even a player himself (!!!). There's a great summary of reviews about the book here ( https://www.pian…
I can't help but agree. I've been playing piano since childhood too, though in a desultory, non-Conservatory way. It's been great fun reading through this comment section and seeing Piano HN, but I'm really surprised that this is the first comment that acknowledges the skub-nature [0] of the book, and that the author doesn't actually play piano but in fact armchair-QBs it via observation and discussion with his two d…
Re: Fundamentals of Piano Practice
#137Earlier quoted context omitted.
The main takeaways for me were: - Do not try to practice the whole piece at once. Split it into pieces - Start by listening to the piece. If possible get multiple performances/recordings (usually easy with YouTube) to get a feel for different interpretations. - Take the piece and number each measure from 1 to finish. Figure out where the repetitions are, which measures are the easiest, which the hardest (this will di…
> Do not try to practice the whole piece at once. Split it into pieces This has been my biggest ever piano hack. I now practice bar-by-bar and don't move on until I'm happy, and its taken my practice to a whole new level
However, it seems like it would be a motivation killer. I'd have thought there was more emotional value in getting through the whole piece, to hear each part in context, to "follow the story".
Can you talk about this method's interaction with your motivation? Would it suit an absolute beginner?
(I'm commenting from my imagination rather than experience. I almost always rely on a sequencer to play for me ;-) )
Re: Fundamentals of Piano Practice
#138Earlier quoted context omitted.
I had to laugh out loud when I read that the author openly admits to not being a pianist or a piano teacher... but a physicist. It reminds me a lot of physicists I know who approach every problem with the assumption that they can do it better than people who have been trying to solve the problem long before. On occasion, they are right, but this clearly appears to be one of those other times.
As both a physicist and a pianist, I have to comment that it’s not only physicists that make these assumptions.
I'm not even a physicist but I cannot help but to see non linear interpolated curves and surfaces when I hear music. (curvature being somehow related to dissonance).
Re: Fundamentals of Piano Practice
#139Have to chime-in here as a piano player since age 7 (so been going for ~28 now), who about 2 years ago got very serious about Jazz. I have stumbled across this book many times, I have read it. It's the single most controversial book that I've read about piano technique and playing that I've found. The author, is not even a player himself (!!!). There's a great summary of reviews about the book here ( https://www.pian…
I don't play piano, but my seven year old daughter does. She's doing her grade 2 exam soon enough. I would also second that advice too! My wife taught her some basics but we got a private teacher for her about a year ago, that has supercharged her ability. She does a 40 minute lesson once a week. The teacher writes notes on what she is to practice and learn. She practices her work for about an hour a day, and spends…
That's really cool, could you elaborate?
Re: Fundamentals of Piano Practice
#140Does this book cover how to figure out finger numbering for sheet music that doesn't have finger numbering? By finger numbering I mean the standard scheme where thumb=1, index=2, ..., pinky=5, and the notes on the sheet music have these numbers. This is the biggest mystery to me. I understand there is not a One True Canonical Fingering for a given sequence of notes. But some fingerings make the music much easier than…
That said, many fingering choices are practical and dictated by the geography of the keyboard and the oddities of our hand anatomy. Armed with a knowledge of the fingering of all of the major and minor scales, the patterns and paradigms encountered in actual compositions become clearer. I recommend MacFarren's scale book but there are others. Beyond pattern recognition and an attempt to understand the musical intent, there's just trial and error. When approaching a new work, I'll spend quite a bit of time trying options in ambiguous passages. It's time well-spent. Pro-tip: don't write in every single finger number. It creates too much visual distraction on the page. Write in only when there's an inflection point. If you have a descending passage in the RH that is 5-4-3-2-1-3-2-1, let's say, just write the 5...1-3 or possibly just 5...3. String players are the absolute best at this concept, only annotating finger numbers when there's a shift of position or an odd extension.