Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Former U.S. officials describe details of the CIA’s proposals to abduct Assange

news.yahoo.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

131–140 of 282 posts

Re: Former U.S. officials describe details of the CIA’s proposals to abduct Assange

#131

Post by adventured »

michaelmrose wrote: post #112
viktorcode wrote: post #100

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If I'm not mistaken this is allowed by the US law.

It's illegal and was probably on its face grounds for convicting Obama along with a laundry list of former executives except nobody has the political will to do it.

Well, Biden just murdered an innocent family in Afghanistan with a drone strike on a car to score cheap political points, to be shown doing something in response to the bombing at the Afghanistan airport that killed US soldiers during the evacuation. It's hard to figure out if any lines exist at this point, legally, for the President when it comes to commiting war crimes (and obviously George W Bush and numerous of the people in his administration should be in prison).

After Biden was done murdering innocent people in Afghanistan, then he stabbed our oldest ally - France - in the back to such a degree they pulled their ambassador in anger.

Good thing we got rid of Trump, he was super damaging to the US reputation and relationships in Europe and around the world.

Re: Former U.S. officials describe details of the CIA’s proposals to abduct Assange

#132

Post by hutzlibu »

adventured wrote: post #130
hutzlibu wrote: post #106

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"I think people just underestimate what spy agencies actually do and how dirty it’s always been. " They do. But maybe they do, because of being told by the governments and in schools, that the CIA and co only fight terrorist and evil empires. Those leaks showed the general public more of the real picture, not the fake official one. And sure, they do not like that.

> because of being told by the governments and in schools, that the CIA and co only fight terrorist and evil empires. That's not their image in the US at all and that's not how formal education about the CIA works in schools in the US. The opposite is closer to the truth. You're maybe aware of the common American conspiracy theory that JFK was murdered by the CIA? As retribution for the Bay of Pigs, among other thing…

There has been some shift in cultural perception, true (even though "Day of the condor" is even from 1975)

- but the official picture and the ones painted by a common movie, is still a very different one, from reality. I mean take James Bond for instance. Glorification of the noble spycraft par excellence. (but I have not watched the latest ones, maybe there was change, too?)

And I have no first hand experience with US school education, but here in germany we kind of were educated about our intelligence agencies(and about the ones of the US) in a very friendly way. One that does not match reality.

Re: Former U.S. officials describe details of the CIA’s proposals to abduct Assange

#133

Post by gatvol »

throwawaybutwhy wrote: post #104
sydthrowaway wrote: post #35

Assange needs to keep going. The Mandela moment is only a couple of political cycles away.

Nah. He has no uMkhonto we Sizwe behind him, nor a nation state financing, training, and arming his comrades, nor a wave of public opinion nor a wide international boycott of his enemies. Just a lonely guy rotting in prison.

MK was spectacularly ineffective

Re: Former U.S. officials describe details of the CIA’s proposals to abduct Assange

#135

Post by pvg »

photochemsyn wrote: post #62

The real reason they were so pissed off at Assange seems to be in two parts: 1) The Chelsea Manning State Department cables. The video was all the hype, but just dig through the 'SECRET' cables on Iraq, Saudi Arabia, etc. Zero interest in 'human rights and democracy', lots of interests in oilfields, pipelines, military sales contracts, etc. 2) Those Vault7 CIA leaks are incredibly embarrassing, it's like so closet cr…

Zero interest in 'human rights and democracy', lots of interests in oilfields, pipelines, military sales contracts, etc.

You can go to the cable archive and type 'human rights' in the search box and see this isn't remotely true. Whatever one might think of US diplomacy and its goals, the cables are mostly of historical interest and cause for mild embarrassment. They don't really show some diabolically clever empire cynically manipulating the world. They mostly show it pursuing its publicly stated goals and interests - one can have a pretty dim view of these goals and interests but you don't need the cables to develop or support that viewpoint.

Re: Former U.S. officials describe details of the CIA’s proposals to abduct Assange

#136

Post by [deleted] »

pydry wrote: post #121
elpin wrote: post #96

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It shows they wanted to prevent Hillary from building supporters to hurt her campaign and were explicitly strategizing how to achieve that end: "if you have anything hillary related we want it in the next tweo [sic] days prefable [sic] because the DNC is approaching and she will solidify bernie supporters" They explain their interest in a Bernie angle as a result of Trump, in their minds, having a low probability of…

Yes, they were. Fox News hate democrats. CNN hate Republicans. Assange hated Clinton ever since she said "wouldnt it be easier if we just drone striked him?". He still didnt conceal any leaks in pursuit of that goal and he wasnt a russian spy. Nonetheless, both claims are frequently made in the mainstream media linked to Democrats. They are lies.

[deleted]

Re: Former U.S. officials describe details of the CIA’s proposals to abduct Assange

#137

Post by techrat »

throwaway210222 wrote: post #47
setpatchaddress wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It’s not just “Establishment Democrats”. He literally acted as a stooge for the Russian government in publishing DNC emails but suppressing damaging information on Republicans.

Surely, as a non-American he could chose any side he felt like? Much like I can - randomly or otherwise - choose any faction in the Nigerian elections. Or is their some planet-wide law that he fell under?

'Choosing a side' is what ceased to allow him to claim he was an impartial leaker and/or journalist.

Re: Former U.S. officials describe details of the CIA’s proposals to abduct Assange

#138

Post by 29athrowaway »

wffurr wrote: post #127
29athrowaway wrote: post #126

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you own a bakery, the ingredients you use need to be transported to your bakery. Once there, they have to be processed by some form of equipment. Your employees and customers need to physically go to your bakery... Every activity in that bakery, in one way or another, depends on energy. That is also true for any other economic activity. By selling energy you effectively have a share of everyone's business. Also, i…

Are you trying to say we can’t have energy and care about human rights and decency? The United States has plenty of domestic energy reserves and the capability to build a lot of renewable energy and nuclear energy. There’s zero reason to be catering to Middle East despots, other than corruption and cronyism.

I never said anything related to that.

But governments and organized crime have a lot in common.

Re: Former U.S. officials describe details of the CIA’s proposals to abduct Assange

#139

Post by deanCommie »

simorley wrote: post #125
photochemsyn wrote: post #62

The real reason they were so pissed off at Assange seems to be in two parts: 1) The Chelsea Manning State Department cables. The video was all the hype, but just dig through the 'SECRET' cables on Iraq, Saudi Arabia, etc. Zero interest in 'human rights and democracy', lots of interests in oilfields, pipelines, military sales contracts, etc. 2) Those Vault7 CIA leaks are incredibly embarrassing, it's like so closet cr…

> Zero interest in 'human rights and democracy', lots of interests in oilfields, pipelines, military sales contracts, etc. Is this a shock to anyone? "Human rights and democracy" is the new imperial "white man's burden". We use it to justify invading, colonizing and stealing from others. When have we ever cared about human rights and democracy? I forget if it was chomsky or someone else who said that we've murdered m…

I 100% agree with everything you're saying.

However, let's not forget that 50/80 years were dominated by a two-headed fight for world hegemony under the threat of nuclear war and potential apocalypse.

In this fight, while the US was far more evil than anyone cared to admit at the time, and the USSR far less than the US propaganda would have you believe, RELATIVELY speaking one side did offer more freedom, liberty, and prosperity than the other. And the primary counterargument from the Communists was https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Whataboutism

This remains true today with China. CPC apologists are all too happy to point out (factually correct) gaps in US integrity and freedom. But in the grand scheme of things, relatively speaking, for all it's flaws, "The West" still has due process, doesn't ban religious expression, and doesn't put millions of citizens into force re-education camps.

The most recent Chinese return of the 2 incarcerated Canadians in return for the Huawei executive is the most blatant current example that China will do absolutely whatever it wants.

Whereas even in this news story - where you have government agents freely discussing assassinating Assange - there are others working against them, Lawyers using legal guidelines to flummox the plan, and ultimately it doesn't go forward.

For all of the US's evils, Russia and China would not have hesitated to kidnap or execute Assange in identical circumstances if he was hiding in an Ecuadorian embassy on their soil. He would have been disappeared a decade ago.

Post reply on HN