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Former U.S. officials describe details of the CIA’s proposals to abduct Assange

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Re: Former U.S. officials describe details of the CIA’s proposals to abduct Assange

#121

Post by pydry »

elpin wrote: post #96
pydry wrote: post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This suggests they wanted Bernie to win. In any case, hitting up sources for leaks is, well, journalism.

It shows they wanted to prevent Hillary from building supporters to hurt her campaign and were explicitly strategizing how to achieve that end: "if you have anything hillary related we want it in the next tweo [sic] days prefable [sic] because the DNC is approaching and she will solidify bernie supporters" They explain their interest in a Bernie angle as a result of Trump, in their minds, having a low probability of…

Yes, they were. Fox News hate democrats. CNN hate Republicans. Assange hated Clinton ever since she said "wouldnt it be easier if we just drone striked him?".

He still didnt conceal any leaks in pursuit of that goal and he wasnt a russian spy. Nonetheless, both claims are frequently made in the mainstream media linked to Democrats.

They are lies.

Re: Former U.S. officials describe details of the CIA’s proposals to abduct Assange

#122

Post by washadjeffmad »

tkojames wrote: post #70
atok1 wrote: post #64

At this point, if you can't see how fucked up the US legal system is, I am sorry. Federal court has in the 90 percent conviction rate. Is it because they have such air tight cases and evidence to follow? No, it's a purely political kangaroo court. Someone would do well do wipe this cancerous 'judicial' system off grid.

Eh how is it purely political kangaroo court with jury convinctions? And for sure they only bring cases they think they can win they admit to this.. for sure having money helps get you better defense. But a purely political kangaroo is a pretty big stretch. Unless you are talking about the secret FISA courts sure. What is way more scary is the whole killing USA citizen via drone strikes in foreign countries no court…

Peremptory challenges?

Re: Former U.S. officials describe details of the CIA’s proposals to abduct Assange

#123

Post by michaelmrose »

dehrmann wrote: post #88
h2odragon wrote: post #2

Wasn't Wikileaks supposed to have been the means by which Russia took the election from Clinton? Why would the Trump administration be so unhappy with them? Were they perhaps continuing the previous administrations' "sweetness and light" approach?

> Russia took the election from Clinton? Clinton's sense of entitlement and both parties' history of not supporting the working class lost her the election.

She lost because she was a woman and because she rightly declared a large chunk of America is deplorable at the same time as Trump was speaking so effectively both to those deplorables and to many who felt left behind in our current America.

Re: Former U.S. officials describe details of the CIA’s proposals to abduct Assange

#124

Post by pydry »

filoeleven wrote: post #103
pydry wrote: post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This suggests they wanted Bernie to win. In any case, hitting up sources for leaks is, well, journalism.

No, it only suggests that they did not want Bernie supporters to solidify behind Clinton. The strongest suggestion is that they did not want Clinton to win.

Yeah, he did. Disliking Clinton does not make him dishonest, a Russian spy or somebody who acted against the principles of wikileaks, however.

It makes him a journalist who doesnt appreciate being threatened with a drone strike by a sitting secretary of state for practising journalism.

The fact people give him shit for this is pretty unbelievable.

Excusing Russian style journalist assassination is not compatible with respect for Democracy.

Re: Former U.S. officials describe details of the CIA’s proposals to abduct Assange

#125

Post by simorley »

photochemsyn wrote: post #62

The real reason they were so pissed off at Assange seems to be in two parts: 1) The Chelsea Manning State Department cables. The video was all the hype, but just dig through the 'SECRET' cables on Iraq, Saudi Arabia, etc. Zero interest in 'human rights and democracy', lots of interests in oilfields, pipelines, military sales contracts, etc. 2) Those Vault7 CIA leaks are incredibly embarrassing, it's like so closet cr…

> Zero interest in 'human rights and democracy', lots of interests in oilfields, pipelines, military sales contracts, etc.

Is this a shock to anyone? "Human rights and democracy" is the new imperial "white man's burden". We use it to justify invading, colonizing and stealing from others. When have we ever cared about human rights and democracy? I forget if it was chomsky or someone else who said that we've murdered more people, caused more human suffering and stolen more wealth in the name of "human rights and democracy" than nazi germany did in the name of nazism. Think about that.

I wish the non-western world would just collectively laugh at and mock any western leader when they talk about "human rights", "democracy", "western values", etc. How can they stand the hypocrisy? How can we?

Re: Former U.S. officials describe details of the CIA’s proposals to abduct Assange

#126

Post by 29athrowaway »

photochemsyn wrote: post #62

The real reason they were so pissed off at Assange seems to be in two parts: 1) The Chelsea Manning State Department cables. The video was all the hype, but just dig through the 'SECRET' cables on Iraq, Saudi Arabia, etc. Zero interest in 'human rights and democracy', lots of interests in oilfields, pipelines, military sales contracts, etc. 2) Those Vault7 CIA leaks are incredibly embarrassing, it's like so closet cr…

If you own a bakery, the ingredients you use need to be transported to your bakery. Once there, they have to be processed by some form of equipment. Your employees and customers need to physically go to your bakery...

Every activity in that bakery, in one way or another, depends on energy. That is also true for any other economic activity.

By selling energy you effectively have a share of everyone's business.

Also, if you control the fuel supply, you can control entire economies.

Re: Former U.S. officials describe details of the CIA’s proposals to abduct Assange

#127

Post by wffurr »

29athrowaway wrote: post #126
photochemsyn wrote: post #62

The real reason they were so pissed off at Assange seems to be in two parts: 1) The Chelsea Manning State Department cables. The video was all the hype, but just dig through the 'SECRET' cables on Iraq, Saudi Arabia, etc. Zero interest in 'human rights and democracy', lots of interests in oilfields, pipelines, military sales contracts, etc. 2) Those Vault7 CIA leaks are incredibly embarrassing, it's like so closet cr…

If you own a bakery, the ingredients you use need to be transported to your bakery. Once there, they have to be processed by some form of equipment. Your employees and customers need to physically go to your bakery... Every activity in that bakery, in one way or another, depends on energy. That is also true for any other economic activity. By selling energy you effectively have a share of everyone's business. Also, i…

Are you trying to say we can’t have energy and care about human rights and decency?

The United States has plenty of domestic energy reserves and the capability to build a lot of renewable energy and nuclear energy. There’s zero reason to be catering to Middle East despots, other than corruption and cronyism.

Re: Former U.S. officials describe details of the CIA’s proposals to abduct Assange

#128

Post by aschlafly »

simorley wrote: post #125
photochemsyn wrote: post #62

The real reason they were so pissed off at Assange seems to be in two parts: 1) The Chelsea Manning State Department cables. The video was all the hype, but just dig through the 'SECRET' cables on Iraq, Saudi Arabia, etc. Zero interest in 'human rights and democracy', lots of interests in oilfields, pipelines, military sales contracts, etc. 2) Those Vault7 CIA leaks are incredibly embarrassing, it's like so closet cr…

> Zero interest in 'human rights and democracy', lots of interests in oilfields, pipelines, military sales contracts, etc. Is this a shock to anyone? "Human rights and democracy" is the new imperial "white man's burden". We use it to justify invading, colonizing and stealing from others. When have we ever cared about human rights and democracy? I forget if it was chomsky or someone else who said that we've murdered m…

Why do you think even the pro-democracy forces in China see the US's support of "democrats" as a farce? Why do you think the images in HK of protestors with the US flag were seen as nothing short of treason, even among the liberals of China? The hypocrisy is so obvious, and the naked self-interest too glaring.

The US's foreign policy has set back the cause of democracy and liberalization in China by decades with its underhanded shenanigans. To recieve their support, even moral support, is the kiss of death in China.

Re: Former U.S. officials describe details of the CIA’s proposals to abduct Assange

#130

Post by adventured »

hutzlibu wrote: post #106
marcinzm wrote: post #85

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> That's kind of insanely deceptive and criminal I think. That just seems like standard for spy agencies along with a pretty mild black propaganda angle. Even books about WW2 propaganda cover the topic. I think people just underestimate what spy agencies actually do and how dirty it’s always been.

"I think people just underestimate what spy agencies actually do and how dirty it’s always been. " They do. But maybe they do, because of being told by the governments and in schools, that the CIA and co only fight terrorist and evil empires. Those leaks showed the general public more of the real picture, not the fake official one. And sure, they do not like that.

> because of being told by the governments and in schools, that the CIA and co only fight terrorist and evil empires.

That's not their image in the US at all and that's not how formal education about the CIA works in schools in the US. The opposite is closer to the truth.

You're maybe aware of the common American conspiracy theory that JFK was murdered by the CIA? As retribution for the Bay of Pigs, among other things.

Every other Hollywood movie in which they make an appearance has portrayed the CIA as up to no good for decades now, especially when it comes to topics like the war on drugs and terrorism. They're frequently portrayed as duplicitous and incompetent. That's because that's how the culture views them at this point. They do not have a good reputation with the American public.

See: American Made (2017), Kill the Messenger (2014), Syriana (2005), The Siege (1998), The Jason Bourne movies, among many others

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