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Anxiety Looks Different in Men

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131–140 of 241 posts

Re: Anxiety Looks Different in Men

#131
post #66

This is a great article. For years I didn't know how to handle anxiety so I handled it "like a man" which lead to a pretty decent drinking habit. Now that I've stopped drinking and being open about what's going on with me, my anxiety looks like traditional anxiety which was easy for my gp to help diagnose. Taking the leap to be open and get help was the best thing to happen to me in years.

For this audience, I would add that anxiety is in some sense often a career positive. During the years I spent as a sysadmin, the continuous feeling that something was about to gowrong and I really needed to prepare for it was useful to my employers. Even if it was bad for me, my relationships, and my physical health.

I often times think my anxiety is what my employers value the most in me and it drives me mad :)

Re: Anxiety Looks Different in Men

#132
post #98

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That just sounds like misandry. Society has an attitude problem with women in some respects too, but people just call it misogyny, not "toxic femininity" or whatever. Being consistent with terminology is sadly underrated.

Misandry is the state of being predisposed or prejudiced against men. Toxic masculinity is stereotypical or reductive modes of action or thinking perceived by men as expected or required, which can be harmful to other men or other people. They're not the same and it'd be not great to think that they are the same.

True. Though misandry also includes the devaluing of certain ways a masculine identifying person might express that masculinity, just as misogyny also includes ways the devaluing of certain ways a feminine identifying person might express their femininity. Misandry is not simply the wholesale hatred of men and/or masculinity, just as misogyny is not simply the wholesale hatred of women and/or femininity. Toxic masculinity, as a term, encompasses behaviours which are driven by misogyny, misandry, and the, in masculine people, internalised misandry resulting in the perpetuation of mysogyny and misandrist attitudes.

To see it as caused solely by internalised misandry is limiting. Such a view ignores the fact that toxic masculinity is a gestalt of behaviours driven by many different beliefs and attitudes - it ignores the fact that toxic masculinity is exhibited when mysogynistic or misandrisric behaviours are observed, and the observer is coerced by society to act in that manner thus perpetuating the cycle of sexism, internalised or not.

If we want to address the syndrome we call toxic masculinity, we'll need to dissect it thoroughly. We'll need to name and target each component. As it is composed of behaviours resulting from all forms of sexism, we must address all those named forms of sexism in society from all applicable sources. Everyone in society contributes to toxic masculinity - but in different ways. Clearly a multifaceted approach is required - one in which we must all participate actively.

Sexism is unacceptable and the mechanisms by which sexism perpetuates itself must be destroyed. Language is a very powerful weapon in that fight. We have a direct responsibility to use it effectively and with great precision. Let's carefully examine the words we use in this struggle to eliminate what we call toxic masculinity, because clearly there's some real confusion about what we're talking about here and some debate about who needs take action - because we all need to take action.

Re: Anxiety Looks Different in Men

#135
post #49
post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Had almost exactly the same problem, down to identical symptoms -- same side of my body, etc. My guess it that it's due to some supplements I was taking years ago (chiefly 5-HTP and magnesium) causing chest pain and/or heart palpitations, and the experience of that etching trauma into my psyche in a way that makes me experience physical symptoms. The worst part is that it feeds on itself, until I was sitting on a sid…

Why do you attribute this to 5-HTP and magnesium? I take both, and other nootropics, and also experience similar symptoms when I’m stressed.

5-htp is associated with increased anxiety / panic attacks. Found out after I got one. (Racing heart, palpitations out of nowhere, spent a night in hospital doing bunch of heart tests.) There is very little research on it, because it's not patented, but try pubmed etc. iirc it increases anxiety especially in the first days, weeks then it levels out.

Re: Anxiety Looks Different in Men

#136
post #66

This is a great article. For years I didn't know how to handle anxiety so I handled it "like a man" which lead to a pretty decent drinking habit. Now that I've stopped drinking and being open about what's going on with me, my anxiety looks like traditional anxiety which was easy for my gp to help diagnose. Taking the leap to be open and get help was the best thing to happen to me in years.

For this audience, I would add that anxiety is in some sense often a career positive. During the years I spent as a sysadmin, the continuous feeling that something was about to gowrong and I really needed to prepare for it was useful to my employers. Even if it was bad for me, my relationships, and my physical health.

See also insecure overachiever: https://hbr.org/2018/02/if-youre-so-successful-why-are-you-s...

Re: Anxiety Looks Different in Men

#137
post #98

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Society has a serious attitude problem towards men and it is seriously damaging a huge number of people. As I understand it, this is what “toxic masculinity” is supposed to mean.

That just sounds like misandry. Society has an attitude problem with women in some respects too, but people just call it misogyny, not "toxic femininity" or whatever. Being consistent with terminology is sadly underrated.

Toxic femininity is actually a utilized term in the same spheres as toxic masculinity was coined (ie. Academia). Toxic masculinity is not against men but against a false societal pressure that men cannot show weakness, are justified in expressing their anger with violence, and that showing aggressive behavior instead of genuinely healthy human bonding is an acceptable and many substitute. It forces pressure on men to be unable to report when they’ve been sexually assaulted, when they’re anxious, in need of comfort, when they’re mentally ill, etc.

This is how I’ve understood the concept and it seems to fit with the claim that “I am a man and my parents emotionally abused me in response to my deep anxiety disorder in my childhood to force me to avoid treatment for decades”.

Toxic femininity is the same sort of societal expectations for women that are toxic. Women have more pressure to avoid being assertive even when their personalities are naturally more aggressive. That a mother is a mother first and a person second, such that everything she may do as a mother reflects on her worth as a human being.

EDIT: Regarding 'toxic femininity' I've been corrected that this isn't widespread used in this way. It's probably just used this way in my own academic circle and I had made an incorrect assumption. Thanks HN.

Re: Anxiety Looks Different in Men

#139
post #98

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That just sounds like misandry. Society has an attitude problem with women in some respects too, but people just call it misogyny, not "toxic femininity" or whatever. Being consistent with terminology is sadly underrated.

Misandry is the state of being predisposed or prejudiced against men. Toxic masculinity is stereotypical or reductive modes of action or thinking perceived by men as expected or required, which can be harmful to other men or other people. They're not the same and it'd be not great to think that they are the same.

> Toxic masculinity is stereotypical or reductive modes of action or thinking perceived by men as expected or required, which can be harmful to other men or other people.

The part that no one wants to talk about is those behaviors are expected, required, and desired of men in some subcultures—-by both the men and the women of those subcultures. It isn’t purely some internal fault where some men misunderstand local norms but in many cases rather a collective problem of bad norms correctly perceived.

Re: Anxiety Looks Different in Men

#140
post #98

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That just sounds like misandry. Society has an attitude problem with women in some respects too, but people just call it misogyny, not "toxic femininity" or whatever. Being consistent with terminology is sadly underrated.

Toxic femininity is actually a utilized term in the same spheres as toxic masculinity was coined (ie. Academia). Toxic masculinity is not against men but against a false societal pressure that men cannot show weakness, are justified in expressing their anger with violence, and that showing aggressive behavior instead of genuinely healthy human bonding is an acceptable and many substitute. It forces pressure on men to…

> Toxic masculinity is not against men but against a false societal pressure that men cannot show weakness

It seriously needs a name change, because the name implies that masculinity is toxic and that's how I've seen it interpreted.

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