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Amazon, Amid Crackdown on Seller Scams, Fires Employees Over Data Leak

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Re: Amazon, Amid Crackdown on Seller Scams, Fires Employees Over Data Leak

#131

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Some of that seems right, but I don’t agree with the Uber example. Ride sharing has been a much more convenient and reliable service than taxis, and with less fraud (broken meters or credit card machines) and less discrimination (actually willing to drive me to the neighborhood I want). And with Uber I have a record of who drove me where. This seems pretty different from being picked up by a random person on the stre…

Personally I love Uber and avoid taxis as much as possible. The worst Uber ride was still far better than the best taxi I've taken. A driver might be chatty and you have a great conversation, or they just stay quiet. Either ways a much better experience than the angry cab driver. I was a little shocked when Uber sent me my stats for last year 1000+ rides.

This has also been my experience. I think a meta here is that the vast majority of cab drivers don't, and can't, own their cab. Medallion cabs, for instance, are sold based on bids and have gone for upwards of $2 million and as "low" as around $500k. And in some places they have government granted monopolies meaning playing this game is the only way to drive a cab.

So most drivers rent their taxi, often by the day. And since fares are front-loaded (you earn a lot more picking up 100 people for 5 miles, than 1 person for 500 miles) it creates an incentive for taxi drivers to go crazy. Granted that same pressure is ostensibly there for Uber drivers, but I think it's different when your car is your car rather than a temporary asset you just dropped a fair chunk of change to rent for a single day.

Somehow transportation, world wide, always ends up in these sort of scummy monopolistic rackets.

Re: Amazon, Amid Crackdown on Seller Scams, Fires Employees Over Data Leak

#132
post #78

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not sure why it isn't more common to see that on HN. On reddit, it's reliably one of the top comments in such threads.

"It is difficult to get a man to understand something, when his salary depends on his not understanding it." --Upton Sinclair Welcome to The Jungle, baby.

one of the dumbass paid mods on here warned a user for using this "cliche" the other day, fyi

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=18652541

Re: Amazon, Amid Crackdown on Seller Scams, Fires Employees Over Data Leak

#133

My (anecdotal) experience with dodgy sellers was this: I bought something that didn't work correctly, I left a review. The seller contacted me and offered money direct to paypal, bypassing Amazon. They did so by attaching an image with the offer to the ticket. I wasn't comfortable with that kind of interaction, so I informed Amazon. Lots of copious apologies from Amazon, and I assume the company was "fired". But the…

How much money were they offering? I definitely would have taken it, and then re-posted the same review a day later.

They were offering a refund of what I had paid. I really wasn't comfortable with giving them my paypal address.

Re: Amazon, Amid Crackdown on Seller Scams, Fires Employees Over Data Leak

#134

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's a matter of chance that they coincide with some 3rd world country models as the latter's fuels are survival/corruption/perceived lawlessness It's not a matter of chance. The earlier government regulation was better than no regulation, but had significant downsides. Taxi regulation got corrupt and the market didn't work very well. Uber and company came in with technology that worked better than the old government…

Uber and company came in with technology that worked better than the old government bureaucracy at cleaning up and regulating the market. To me, at least, this assertion requires some substantiation. It seems to me that what Uber has been better at than traditional taxi services is solely the technology. I can only expect to hail a taxi on demand if I'm in a big city, airport, train station, or other transit center;…

To me, at least, this assertion requires some substantiation

Then let me invite you to come visit my city, Vancouver, the last major city in North America where ride-share isn't available and taxis are the only game in town.

First, taxi regulations stipulate that taxis get to charge a flat-rate tariff on every ride. They have to/get to charge this. Whatever this tariff was meant to accomplish, it incentivizes taxi drivers to ignore their dispatcher when taxis are in high demand (like on weekend evenings) and only pick up off the street for short hops around downtown. If you need a trip further out (say 5 miles), forget about it - you'll wait for hours before you can get a cab (I have, on multiple occasions).

Second, taxi medallions are crazy-expensive (hundreds of thousands of dollars) and are a cash-cow for municipalities. They're meant to tie taxi cabs to a local city, but they also make elastic cab-supply impossible - you can never have more cabs on the road than you have medallions and because the medallions are so expensive they need to be amortized with constant use. That incentivizes everyone to have far fewer medallions than the industry would need to satisfy demand during peak periods. The most efficient deployment of medallions for a taxi company is to have enough medallions to satisfy minimum, not peak demand.

And don't think that medallions will guarantee good local service - just because a taxi company has a medallion issued by the municipality that you live in doesn't mean that they can pick you up and drive you home. I live in Burnaby (city next to Vancouver) where Bonny's Taxi has a legally-granted monopoly, but if I'm downtown (which is in Vancouver) I can't call Bonny's to pick me up - medallions regulate pick-up, not drop-off.

And even if you manage to flag down a cab on a busy night, they'll quite commonly flat-out refuse to take you anywhere other than downtown. They're barred from doing this, but the industry is self-policing and you can guess how likely it is that a driver would face any consequences for this. Maybe if you film them and post it to social media. But certainly not otherwise. And who can blame them? They have to pay down their medallion-mortgage, and exploiting the flat-rate tariff on short-hop rides downtown is the best way to do that.

Also, carry cash. Many taxi drivers will insist on cash. "Oh, my machine is broken. You need to pay with cash." Again, they're barred from doing this, but again, the industry is self-policing and you can guess how often complaints lead to consequences. It still happens all the time.

And because these are a great bunch of guys, their industry spends millions lobbying the provincial government to stall legislation that would allow ride-share in Vancouver. British Columbia went through a period in the 70's where it was indistinguishable from a Soviet republic with a planned economy, and implemented socialized car insurance. Everyone needs to buy basic liability auto insurance from our govt car insurer (at about twice the market rate in other provinces), and that insurer has simply refused to insure ride-sharers. That's been a far more effective barrier to ride-share than has existed anywhere else that I'm aware of. And the taxi industry spends aggressively to make sure that that doesn't change.

Also, while taxi regulation is pretty corrupt, well, Uber is maybe not the poster child we want for how unregulated companies are gonna do better on that front.

They are exactly that "poster child". Uber at their very very worst is better than the taxi companies and the taxi industry in a city where ride-share isn't available.

Re: Amazon, Amid Crackdown on Seller Scams, Fires Employees Over Data Leak

#135

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Perhaps I spent too much of my youth watching supermarket-themed game shows, but I'm very much in tune with how much things should cost in supermarkets, and how they vary from chain to chain and region to region. It was for that reason I started buying my household stuff at Amazon — because I could save a buck or two, per item, which adds up. Then — as you pointed out — stuff got weird. Amazon's prices became consist…

For the longest time I would have added to your list of things not to buy on Amazon anything claiming to be OEM Apple products. It was likely they were fakes and if they provide electrical power they may be a fire hazard. Amazon seemed to realize how big of a problem this was (or Apple took them aside and made it a problem for them) because they just announced they are taking action: https://motherboard.vice.com/en_u…

I find it a little worrying that in that vice article they don't seem to at all talk about the counterfeiting issue that was widespread on Amazon for Apple products.

Re: Amazon, Amid Crackdown on Seller Scams, Fires Employees Over Data Leak

#136

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Some of that seems right, but I don’t agree with the Uber example. Ride sharing has been a much more convenient and reliable service than taxis, and with less fraud (broken meters or credit card machines) and less discrimination (actually willing to drive me to the neighborhood I want). And with Uber I have a record of who drove me where. This seems pretty different from being picked up by a random person on the stre…

problem with uber from a customer perspective is if you are a single woman taking a ride, the drivers are not full time cab employees that can possibly be fired/lose their cab medallion/permits. some women i know are considering switching to licensed cabs due to the harassment they get from uber drivers with no good mechanism to report and avoid those drivers aside from never traveling alone. as a guy, i've only had…

If the drivers are in any way even possibly breaking the law, then the riders could go to the police. If the drivers were acting in a completely lawful, but undesirable, way then the riders could give the drivers a low rating. It is very safe to assume that the servers of Uber (and all other ride sharing services) work to opaquely disconnect passengers and drivers when either party has given the other a low rating. It's a good and obvious idea on all levels, including even just optimizing for max profit.

Re: Amazon, Amid Crackdown on Seller Scams, Fires Employees Over Data Leak

#137
post #24

One of the first things I remember about moving to a rich country was the absence of knockoff products sold in retail stores. It seemed amazing to me that companies would deal only with authorized distributors. These days, I feel like I'm in a twilight zone where 'wealth creation' is happening by putting a fresh face on 3rd-world country business models. First it was Uber with the "hire a random guy off the street to…

Those “3rd world business models” are amazingly efficient though. Just because the “1st world” is rich doesn’t make us smart, in fact it may be the opposite. Also, when all the bootleg crap and non-bootleg crap is made in the same factories in China, what’s the difference?

Re: Amazon, Amid Crackdown on Seller Scams, Fires Employees Over Data Leak

#138

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Uber and company came in with technology that worked better than the old government bureaucracy at cleaning up and regulating the market. To me, at least, this assertion requires some substantiation. It seems to me that what Uber has been better at than traditional taxi services is solely the technology. I can only expect to hail a taxi on demand if I'm in a big city, airport, train station, or other transit center;…

Ignoring the benefits to taxi drivers, and focusing on a pure economic standpoint, Uber/Lyft did clean up the market place by busting local government taxi commissions which had previously created both economic minimums and maximums around fixed prices and fixed number of cars on the road respectively. This lead drivers to focus on only a certain type of trip, and reduced the total number of rides people took due to…

This said, every tragedy of the commons scenario that was previously avoided by regulation happened,

What are the downsides that regulation avoided, which are now happening?

the streets of major cities are almost entirely cars for hire, where it's nearly impossible to make a living wage working as a driver on only 40 hours a week.

Making a living wage wasn't so great for beginning cab drivers either. They had to rent their cabs from medallion holders, which often meant they had to take a lot of rides before they saw dollar 1.

Re: Amazon, Amid Crackdown on Seller Scams, Fires Employees Over Data Leak

#139

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's a matter of chance that they coincide with some 3rd world country models as the latter's fuels are survival/corruption/perceived lawlessness It's not a matter of chance. The earlier government regulation was better than no regulation, but had significant downsides. Taxi regulation got corrupt and the market didn't work very well. Uber and company came in with technology that worked better than the old government…

Uber and company came in with technology that worked better than the old government bureaucracy at cleaning up and regulating the market. To me, at least, this assertion requires some substantiation. It seems to me that what Uber has been better at than traditional taxi services is solely the technology. I can only expect to hail a taxi on demand if I'm in a big city, airport, train station, or other transit center;…

You have received anecdotes, but not the underlying reason.

With a taxi, if you complain about poor service, the driver will remain a taxi driver. Therefore drivers have little cause to care about customers that they will never see again.

With an Uber driver, drivers that fail to get good reviews quickly stop being Uber drivers. The result is that Uber drivers are much better on average than taxi drivers.

Re: Amazon, Amid Crackdown on Seller Scams, Fires Employees Over Data Leak

#140
post #24

One of the first things I remember about moving to a rich country was the absence of knockoff products sold in retail stores. It seemed amazing to me that companies would deal only with authorized distributors. These days, I feel like I'm in a twilight zone where 'wealth creation' is happening by putting a fresh face on 3rd-world country business models. First it was Uber with the "hire a random guy off the street to…

> Now it's Amazon selling bootleg crap at scale. What's their excuse? Some variant of "move fast, break things", no doubt.

Seems to me Amazon felt they couldn't compete against eBay or AliExpress and still be "low on prices". Essentially they chose that market (including copying sellers products and rebranding them as Essentials) over legitimate sales.

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