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Steve Jurvetson is out at his own VC firm after allegations of sexual harassment

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Re: Steve Jurvetson is out at his own VC firm after allegations of sexual harassment

#131

Post by jparse »

s17n wrote: post #101
hkmurakami wrote: post #27

Following these very visible and high profile falls from grace, in politics, media and entertainment, and high tech, there must be some legitimate concerns that in the near future the Billy Graham rule [1] (or lately called the Graham-Pence rule) will find more followers than before. Many men in power will instinctually and subconsciously cut out women from their professional lives more than before, to the detriment…

These guys are all pretty obviously guilty, so I don't see the need to worry. Just follow two simple rules and you'll be fine: 1. Don't sexually assault / harass anybody. 2. Maintain clear boundaries with anybody you have a position of power over - even if it seems completely consensual you just can't hook up or have a romantic relationship with them.

I am not sure SFJ is guilty. Basically, he was overly critical of ideas and pitches he received. The opposing party had their feelings hurt which they attribute to them being female.

Re: Steve Jurvetson is out at his own VC firm after allegations of sexual harassment

#132

Post by throwawaymanbot »

gozur88 wrote: post #112
sitkack wrote: post #109

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The feminists The people who think women should be equal ...

Sure. Just like the communists thought people should be equal.

Wow.... comments like that can get you banned from places like this.

Re: Steve Jurvetson is out at his own VC firm after allegations of sexual harassment

#133

Post by abiox »

ceejayoz wrote: post #114
tankenmate wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sometimes it isn't just career death https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carl_Sargeant

I've read that article twice and nowhere does it indicate he was cleared of the accusations.

how does one become 'cleared of accusations'?

Re: Steve Jurvetson is out at his own VC firm after allegations of sexual harassment

#134

Post by abiox »

Danihan wrote: post #81
ben_jones wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I had this conversation the other day. HR exists to protect the firm, if that involves sweeping things under the rug, disparaging victims, or enabling illegal behavior by high performers, they will, and historically have, done it.

HR departments are intended to protect the company from liability. Generally speaking, they do that by taking standardized actions regarding harassment claims because otherwise they open the company up to lawsuits and negative PR. Basically, it's irrational to try to cover up or ignore harassment in the vast majority of cases. Which is why HR is a perfectly decent solution for most of these issues, and we only hear a…

> Basically, it's irrational to try to cover up or ignore harassment in the vast majority of cases.

how did you reach that assessment? this would seem to only apply to behavior that was openly visible and recurring.

Re: Steve Jurvetson is out at his own VC firm after allegations of sexual harassment

#135

Post by abiox »

sitkack wrote: post #122
abiox wrote: post #117

Earlier quoted context omitted.

i suppose it depends on there being a similar circumstance. if accusations of interpersonal 'racial harassment' became more regular, you would probably see a shift in behavior with some people going out of their way to avoid 'risky' situations.

The chicken littles claiming this problem exists in the first place are publicly scared they are next. This they admit outright. I'd wager that people making these claims probably _do_ have this as a risk, for good reason.

this mindset seems a bit like a 'if you have nothing to hide...' view on privacy. they're only concerned because they're villains?

Re: Steve Jurvetson is out at his own VC firm after allegations of sexual harassment

#136

Post by aaron695 »

abiox wrote: post #126
aaron695 wrote: post #95

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As such I would not want to work with you or hire you, man or woman. Work is the majority of many peoples lives. Human touch is fucking important to most homosapians and is used continiuosly and importantly in most interactions (like other things like the obvious talking but also smell and body language) I understand you might have a disorder or be atypical but the problem is you seem to think societies entire wellbe…

> Human touch is fucking important if it's important to you, that's why you have friends and family. i'm sure as an adult you can handle not fondling other adults at work, because even if you think 'it's important', you don't know what kind of space other people are in and how they feel about you touching them.

I assume english is not your first language.

Fondling is not even close to the word touching.

Fondling is about sexuality.

Touching is a physical action. You touch a cup. You touch a dog. You touch a touch screen. You touch someone when you shake their hand.

Roughly, you can't fondle a cup. You wouldn't say you fondle a dog, and you won't say you fondle friends and family.

(And I do know spaces my workmates are in... as much as family and friends, so should you if you are able. Human beings matter, a workplace is more than money)

Re: Steve Jurvetson is out at his own VC firm after allegations of sexual harassment

#137

Post by ScottBurson »

downandout wrote: post #28
opportune wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The crux of the problem is how to set up a system where people feel comfortable coming forward without creating one that incentivizes false accusations. This is exacerbated by the externalities surrounding sexual misconduct: sometimes it's one word against another, sometimes the evidence isn't that strong, and many victims are so impacted by the misconduct/abuse that they may not want to relive the experience through…

This woman likely does not have enough money to compensate him for the actual damages that would be awarded at trial should he prevail, let alone any punitive damages. Lost potential earnings etc. would likely be in the billions in this case. For all intents and purposes, the lawsuit and any money he did recover would be meaningless except perhaps as a personal vindication. His career ended when she made the accusati…

> His career ended when she made the accusation.

That doesn't seem to me to be true. DFJ carried out some kind of investigation, as the article mentions. I don't agree with your assertion that any evidence they found would have been leaked by now (or would necessarily ever be leaked). And I can't believe that DFJ's investigation into such an important person in their organization would have been cursory, nor that they would fire him without substantial cause.

We don't know what the investigation found, and we may never know. That doesn't mean there wasn't anything.

Re: Steve Jurvetson is out at his own VC firm after allegations of sexual harassment

#138

Post by weissguy1 »

MsMowz wrote: post #13
downandout wrote: post #11

This may get downvotes, but the speed with which careers are being destroyed based on mere allegations of sexual misconduct these days is frightening. While the allegations in this case may or may not be true, it is actually possible for a woman to make a false allegation of sexual misconduct. There are myriad reasons that someone would make make such a false allegation against a powerful VC. Yet in today’s environme…

>Yet in today’s environment, even if he ultimately proves himself to be innocent through the lawsuit he claims he is going to file against his accuser, a career death sentence has already been carried out by a virtual lynch mob. That is wrong. Has this ever actually happened?

Joe Lonsdale?

Re: Steve Jurvetson is out at his own VC firm after allegations of sexual harassment

#139

Post by sillysaurus3 »

egwynn wrote: post #105
jparse wrote: post #100

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The threat model is an accusation. You are toast if you even get one accusation because it is cheaper to just get rid of you even if you are innocent. Frankly, I think he is not being cautious enough because the term "sexual harassment" has also moved into the realm of disagreement. Maybe you don't like her work and criticize it or maybe you are her boss and not agreeing with her performance. Most women quickly figur…

Yes, accusations were what I had in mind when I framed it as “threat model” in the question. it is cheaper to just get rid of you even if you are innocent Is it? One clearly has some value to their employer. Replacing an employee isn’t free either. It’s also not “free” to add social friction to interactions with one's coworkers. As best I know, this has never happened to anyone in / near my social network. That leads…

As best I know, this has never happened to anyone in / near my social network. That leads me to believe that this isn’t something that happens very often in the general population (unless I’m an outlier). And if it’s so rare, then it doesn’t seem to be worth going out of my way for.

This works till it doesn't. All it takes is once.

Raw statistics are worth internalizing, but in an era where a slip of the tongue is enough to hang you (socially), it's worth being overcautious.

Re: Steve Jurvetson is out at his own VC firm after allegations of sexual harassment

#140

Post by sctb »

aaron695 wrote: post #95
astura wrote: post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm a woman and I am a feminist. Unless you are an actor or dancer any sort of touching with coworkers is very inappropriate for all genders, sexual or non sexual touching included. Keeping your work and professional lives separate is just good sense. It's rude to make comments about other people's appearances unless you are very close friends with them. Closed door meetings are sometimes needed but you should never…

As such I would not want to work with you or hire you, man or woman. Work is the majority of many peoples lives. Human touch is fucking important to most homosapians and is used continiuosly and importantly in most interactions (like other things like the obvious talking but also smell and body language) I understand you might have a disorder or be atypical but the problem is you seem to think societies entire wellbe…

The kind of personal incivility that you've included in this comment is in no way OK on Hacker News. We've banned the account.
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