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What's next Google? Dropping SMTP support?

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Re: What's next Google? Dropping SMTP support?

#121

Post by kalleboo »

Maarten88 wrote: post #106
esolyt wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>I'm starting to think that Microsoft are a more "open" company... I am disappointed too. But why is Microsoft more open? Does Microsoft have an open messaging protocol that I don't know of? Or an open source operating system? Or an open source browser? The last I checked, they were forcing manufacturers to ship computers with locked down bootloaders so you can't install your own operating system. >But they're privac…

> Does Microsoft have an open messaging protocol that I don't know of? Even better, they support an standard called SIP. [1] > Or an open source operating system? Or an open source browser? They believe in open standards more than open source, although the Azure group very actively supports open source lately [1] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Session_Initiation_Protocol

> Even better, they support an standard called SIP. [1]

Not in Skype they don't

Re: What's next Google? Dropping SMTP support?

#122

Post by kalleboo »

Shooti wrote: post #54
reidrac wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's for the new Hangouts service. If you can keep using XMPP with your Gmail account, then it's not that terrible. I don't know if it's a forced replacement. We may need to wait for Google's announcement.

"Not federated support, but supports interop with XMPP clients. Meaning you can continue to use XMPP clients to log in to Google Talk and those messages will interop with folks on Hangouts." https://plus.google.com/107968525907303243288/posts/HFe3W7A9... So Google Talk will continue to live on (which allows them to implement some sort of server side functionality which converts a Gtalk message to a Hangout message wh…

In another comment there he also says "for the time being" so you can expect this to disappear in a year or so.

Re: What's next Google? Dropping SMTP support?

#123

Post by thwarted »

Shooti wrote: post #54
reidrac wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's for the new Hangouts service. If you can keep using XMPP with your Gmail account, then it's not that terrible. I don't know if it's a forced replacement. We may need to wait for Google's announcement.

"Not federated support, but supports interop with XMPP clients. Meaning you can continue to use XMPP clients to log in to Google Talk and those messages will interop with folks on Hangouts." https://plus.google.com/107968525907303243288/posts/HFe3W7A9... So Google Talk will continue to live on (which allows them to implement some sort of server side functionality which converts a Gtalk message to a Hangout message wh…

Being forced to use a third party client will hopefully improve the quality of the third party clients. I hate how the current gtalk android app forces you to see/use all Google accounts configured on your phone and there is no way to reliably turn off never logging into one (say, an account you are trying to deprecate). Unfortunately, every other XMPP client for android has some serious deficiency (often a terrible UI).

Re: What's next Google? Dropping SMTP support?

#124

Post by leoc »

yanw wrote: post #18

Hyperbole aside (they won’t drop SMTP) that is a very narrow and unfair view on the situation, they at least tried for years to make it work with these standards and failed. They were obviously the last ones doing so, and this new approach is mainly about modernising their infrastructure. Is there anyone else of any consequence out there who is building these sorts of messaging apps on top of XMPP? Google was the las…

Web "standards" are a carve-up between a de-facto closed group of four (recently down from five) browser vendors.

Re: What's next Google? Dropping SMTP support?

#125

Post by raldi »

Samuel_Michon wrote: post #87
wslh wrote: post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I guess open standards don't work when you're the guy trying to lock in users. That's obvious for Google too. They don't open source their search engine (or even Google Reader!). They open source a browser and an operating system to sell other stuff. For Google open source is a weapon.

“They open source a browser and an operating system to sell other stuff.” No, those were already open source before Google got involved, so Google didn’t really have a choice.

So were BSD and KHTML, and yet when Apple built OS X and iOS and Safari on top of them, they did it closed-source.

Re: What's next Google? Dropping SMTP support?

#126

Post by reidrac »

thwarted wrote: post #123
Shooti wrote: post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Not federated support, but supports interop with XMPP clients. Meaning you can continue to use XMPP clients to log in to Google Talk and those messages will interop with folks on Hangouts." https://plus.google.com/107968525907303243288/posts/HFe3W7A9... So Google Talk will continue to live on (which allows them to implement some sort of server side functionality which converts a Gtalk message to a Hangout message wh…

Being forced to use a third party client will hopefully improve the quality of the third party clients. I hate how the current gtalk android app forces you to see/use all Google accounts configured on your phone and there is no way to reliably turn off never logging into one (say, an account you are trying to deprecate). Unfortunately, every other XMPP client for android has some serious deficiency (often a terrible…

I use Xabber and I'm very happy with it:

https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.xabber.and...

But if I can't talk with my contacts using a Gmail account, then is not that useful.

Re: What's next Google? Dropping SMTP support?

#127

Post by mtgx »

recoiledsnake wrote: post #47

Wait, so Google is dropping XMPP support because Outlook.com is supporting it to allow Gtalk users to chat on Outlook.com, so in order to perpetuate the GMail/GTalk lock-in by caging the Gtalk chat users to GMail, they're dropping standards support and killing access to all XMPP clients in existence including non-Microsoft ones? And they announce this right when Microsoft spent all the time and effort to allow Outloo…

Microsoft actually did not want to open the .doc format. I believe they were forced to do it.

Re: What's next Google? Dropping SMTP support?

#128

Post by npsimons »

laumars wrote: post #26
yanw wrote: post #18

Hyperbole aside (they won’t drop SMTP) that is a very narrow and unfair view on the situation, they at least tried for years to make it work with these standards and failed. They were obviously the last ones doing so, and this new approach is mainly about modernising their infrastructure. Is there anyone else of any consequence out there who is building these sorts of messaging apps on top of XMPP? Google was the las…

Coincidentally, only yesterday I installed an XMPP daemon on one of my servers and configured it as a message relay so I can send and receive SMS from my PC via my phone. Facebook chat also uses XMPP. So in answer to your question: yes, there are people still building new stuff on top of XMPP. However I will concede that I'm also a bit IRC advocate - so I'm probably the wrong person to comment on the best newest soci…

the best newest social protocols.

Better known as "reinvention of shit that already worked because we want to lock you into our platform and monetize your eyeballs."

Re: What's next Google? Dropping SMTP support?

#130

Post by npsimons »

a3_nm wrote: post #42
yanw wrote: post #18

Hyperbole aside (they won’t drop SMTP) that is a very narrow and unfair view on the situation, they at least tried for years to make it work with these standards and failed. They were obviously the last ones doing so, and this new approach is mainly about modernising their infrastructure. Is there anyone else of any consequence out there who is building these sorts of messaging apps on top of XMPP? Google was the las…

> Is there anyone else of any consequence out there who is building these sorts of messaging apps on top of XMPP? I use XMPP to talk with Google Talk users from an XMPP account hosted on my own server. I will be annoyed if Google users are driven away from Google Talk to something that I cannot interact with unless I use a Google account.

Same here; and it's not like it's hard. If you're running a web server and/or DNS, it's as easy as 'apt-get install ejabberd', tweak some well documented settings in the config file, add a few lines to the DNS config, and bam! I'm talking to my friends on GTalk via my own private XMPP server.
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