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Alibaba Cloud says it cut Nvidia AI GPU use by 82% with new pooling system

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Re: Alibaba Cloud says it cut Nvidia AI GPU use by 82% with new pooling system

#121
post #11
post #2

The US attempt to slow down China's technological development succeeds on the basis of preventing China from directly following the same path, but may backfire in the sense it forces innovation by China in a different direction. The overall outcome for us all may be increase efficiency as a result of this forced innovation, especially if Chinese companies continue to open source their advances, so we may in the end h…

History has shown that withholding technology from China does not significantly stop them and they'll achieve it (or better) in a small number of years. In many senses there's hubris in the western* view of China accomplishments: most of what western companies have created has had significant contribution by Chinese scientists or manufacturing, without which those companies would have nothing. If you look at the name…

I am not sure exactly to what degree, but "I hate the term 'western' because some 'weste[r]ners' use it to separated what they think are 'civilized' from 'uncivilized'" is definitely a bit of an antiquated perspective at this point; almost like a justification to hold on to other older perspectives about "racism". I have started resorting to using terms like European Cultural Block because of it in certain communities that understand contemporary topics and have an advanced understanding of the world.

Your first statement is not likely unique to China though, even though they have demonstrated that in about the last 40 years, which I don't really think qualifies as "history". What it does demonstrate is that societies that have a certain kind of ethnic self-respect and can cast off the detrimental influences of foreign, hostile, and even enemy elements to pursue their own self-interest and survival will succeed, regardless of hurdles placed before them.

It's really just a story of personal development and either escaping, evading, and avoiding detrimental, toxic people and their behaviors. All of humanity that all has to currently still share a single planet with ZERO save spots, would be better off if we all not just allowed each other to be ourselves in our won places without others subverting, subjugating, infiltrating, dominating, poisoning, or polluting any other people on the planet. Then everyone can decide if we want to be friends or not friends with each other, collaborate and be friendly or simply avoid each other. We do not have to like each other to get along if everyone agrees on a base understanding that no people can parasitize and abuse and manipulate any others.

Re: Alibaba Cloud says it cut Nvidia AI GPU use by 82% with new pooling system

#122
post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

may backfire? it's a bit too late for that. go to 2024, western labs were crushing it. it's now 2025, and from china, we have deepseek, qwen, kimi, glm, ernie and many more capable models keeping up with western labs. there are actually now more chinese labs releasing sota models than western labs.

But they aren't keeping up They are lauded for the ability to cost ratio, or their ability to parameter ratio, but virtually everyone using LLMs for productive work are using ChatGPT/Gemini/Claude. They are kind of like Huffy bicycles. Good value, work well, but if you go to any serious event, no one will be riding one.

they are keeping up. i have been using just chinese models for the last 2 years. chatgpt/gemini/claude have marketing. there's nothing that you can do with those models that can't be done with deepseek, glm or kimi. if there is, do let us know.

Re: Alibaba Cloud says it cut Nvidia AI GPU use by 82% with new pooling system

#123
post #118

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The new 5 is one of the first cars I've really liked in a while. They really nailed the modern-with-subtle-calls-to-retro look.

Agreed, I'm not a car person and too young to remember the original 5, but it's really good and fun and modern and slightly retro looking. It's almost making me want to buy it, and I have absolutely no use for it.

If you haven't already (which seems unlikely), look into the Renault 5 Turbo.

Bit of an absurd car, but the modern (non-turbo) 5's slight bumps over the rear wheels are such a good callback to the Turbo (the original Renault 5 were basically all flat).

Really fine design stuff IMO.

Re: Alibaba Cloud says it cut Nvidia AI GPU use by 82% with new pooling system

#124
post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

History has shown that withholding technology from China does not significantly stop them and they'll achieve it (or better) in a small number of years. In many senses there's hubris in the western* view of China accomplishments: most of what western companies have created has had significant contribution by Chinese scientists or manufacturing, without which those companies would have nothing. If you look at the name…

Ironically, the best way America could have prevented China’s rise in tech was by stapling green cards to diplomas of Chinese citizens who completed their higher education in the U.S. like the plan in the early 2010s.

Is that the best way? China's rise had already happened by the 2010s

Preventing that could have been prevented in the 70s, 80s, 90s by stopping offshoring, blocking student visas, and prosecuting IP theft.

Re: Alibaba Cloud says it cut Nvidia AI GPU use by 82% with new pooling system

#127
post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> History has shown that withholding technology from China does not significantly stop them and they'll achieve it (or better) in a small number of years. It's worked for a very long time for aircraft. China has been pushing to build its own aircraft for >23 years. It took 14 years for COMAC to get its first regional jet flying commercial flights on a Chinese airline, and 21 years to get a narrow-body plane flying a…

> If for purely political reasons, China may never be able to export these chips to most of the world - which limits their scale - which makes it harder to make them cost effective compared to Western chips. Note that this happens at the same time the US is breaking up its own alliances, so as of this writing, there's no such thing as certainty about politics.

>the same time the US is breaking up its own alliances

This isn't happening. The US is driving a harder bargain with our allies. No one serious thinks anyone is walking away from alliances with the US.

Re: Alibaba Cloud says it cut Nvidia AI GPU use by 82% with new pooling system

#128

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But at the same time they are fielding multiple new stealth aircraft and their jets and missiles outperformed western aircraft in the recent Pakistan India flare-up.

So you'd think they'd be able to build a commercial jet liner, no?

C919

Re: Alibaba Cloud says it cut Nvidia AI GPU use by 82% with new pooling system

#129

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ironically, the best way America could have prevented China’s rise in tech was by stapling green cards to diplomas of Chinese citizens who completed their higher education in the U.S. like the plan in the early 2010s.

Is that the best way? China's rise had already happened by the 2010s Preventing that could have been prevented in the 70s, 80s, 90s by stopping offshoring, blocking student visas, and prosecuting IP theft.

Those students would have just gone to other countries, written their PhD dissertations there, advanced another country’s tech sector, and the US would have found the pain of isolationism that much sooner.

It is not possible to keep core IP secret. HN folks, of all people, should know this. Anything that thousands of people know is de facto public knowledge.

Re: Alibaba Cloud says it cut Nvidia AI GPU use by 82% with new pooling system

#130

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ironically, the best way America could have prevented China’s rise in tech was by stapling green cards to diplomas of Chinese citizens who completed their higher education in the U.S. like the plan in the early 2010s.

Is that the best way? China's rise had already happened by the 2010s Preventing that could have been prevented in the 70s, 80s, 90s by stopping offshoring, blocking student visas, and prosecuting IP theft.

Eh? They are a country with a culture that values education like a few other asian countries. They were set back by the colonial bullshit of Europe, devastation of WW2 and communist revolutions and so. They would have gotten to the same point as they are today, just longer if anything if any attempt was made to hamper it.
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