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Why Explore Space? A 1970 Letter to a Nun in Africa.

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Re: Why Explore Space? A 1970 Letter to a Nun in Africa.

#121

Post by genwin »

lobotryas wrote: post #81
MarkMc wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Good question! Firstly I would like to suggest that even if you can only tackle the symptom, not the cause, it would still be worthwhile - a patient with untreatable cancer should nonetheless get painkillers. You are correct that the number of people in the second generation would be higher than the number you bring out of famine. But if you do nothing the second generation would be even larger still since the fertil…

Thought provoking answer! I'm not OP, but I always wondered: how do nations coming out of poverty (with high birth rates as part of life or tradition) culturally transition to a nation where low birth rates are the norm? The scenario I'm thinking of is a nation that beats poverty and improves standard of living, but falls back into it because the population refuses to adapt and decrease the number of births.

I think it would be almost impossible for their culture to change. One way might be for the first world to pay monthly stipends to families that have no more than 2 kids. Then taper it off over many decades.

Re: Why Explore Space? A 1970 Letter to a Nun in Africa.

#122

Post by genwin »

7952 wrote: post #61
jxcole wrote: post #9

I don't know if this makes me cruel, but whenever people talk about donating money to starving children in Africa, I always imagine the following: If I were to donate some amount of money to starving children in an impoverished nation every year I could, theoretically, bring some of them out of starvation. However, these children would then grow into adults, and then these adults would have children of their own. The…

Doesn't the injustice of that bother you? You are given the power to weigh up life and death, without any chance of ever starving yourself. Such naval gazing is stereotypical of people with full stomachs. Is basic human empathy such a bad reason to try and help?

> Is basic human empathy such a bad reason to try and help?

If the help does more harm than good in the long run, then obviously yes. Whether a particular course of action does more harm than good is open to debate.

Re: Why Explore Space? A 1970 Letter to a Nun in Africa.

#123

Post by genwin »

tomjakubowski wrote: post #96
genwin wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I suspect that excessive influence of religion led to all those other problems.

Excessive influence of religion leads to poverty, poor health, and a high child mortality rate? Do you have any sources to back this besides a general feeling that religion is "bad"?

It's not based on a general feeling. It's based on the fact that resources are limited. Any religion that successfully promotes "be fruitful and multiply" will certainly bump against that limit eventually. I can only suspect in any particular case because something else besides religion could be the main contributor to the bad things.

Re: Why Explore Space? A 1970 Letter to a Nun in Africa.

#124

Post by InclinedPlane »

rbanffy wrote: post #112
jxcole wrote: post #9

I don't know if this makes me cruel, but whenever people talk about donating money to starving children in Africa, I always imagine the following: If I were to donate some amount of money to starving children in an impoverished nation every year I could, theoretically, bring some of them out of starvation. However, these children would then grow into adults, and then these adults would have children of their own. The…

That's why free food alone doesn't work. You have to couple it with healthcare, education, infrastructure and economy reform (because the famine was most likely caused by a failing economy) and maybe political reform. It's more or less rebooting the place.

Famines in the modern age are rarely caused by anything other than war and bad local governance. If one approaches famine from the perspective that the issue is one of food shortage alone then they will be working on the wrong problem.

Re: Why Explore Space? A 1970 Letter to a Nun in Africa.

#126

Post by matt4711 »

Philadelphia wrote: post #116
aroberge wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Anyone who discounts a thoughtful response based on some other criteria than that found in that response is not someone qualified to comment about ethics.

I think the fact that someone was an actual Nazi is enough to raise doubt about any moral arguments he makes.

did you even read the other comments?

"He was also drafted into the Wehrmacht to fight on the Eastern front" doesn't seem like he had a lot of choice there...

Re: Why Explore Space? A 1970 Letter to a Nun in Africa.

#127

Post by coldarchon »

MarkMc wrote: post #62

I don't buy the argument. A $100b space mission is going to have a bigger benefit to the desperately poor than a $100b medical research program? No way. But then, why does the space program need to be defended like that? People prefer buying big TVs, big cars, big houses instead of giving the money to starving Africans. So why not view the space program as just an extension of that?

I don't buy the argument that giving money keeps Africans from starving. 100 years ago the population of Sudan had 1,800,000 people, while according to a census some years ago they managed to multiply by 20. The population is estimated to be at more than 25 times what it had been 100 years ago, to be at 48,000,000. And yet there is hunger every year. Did the arable land multiply by 25?

Re: Why Explore Space? A 1970 Letter to a Nun in Africa.

#128

Post by abcd_f »

joering2 wrote: post #33

Ok, so the story with microscope was a good one. I was initially shortsighted. But coming back to the recent Mars mission, anyone has any ideas, more or less accurate/detailed, of how this particular mission will/could benefit our civilization? This is a serious question.

It's fundamental research. You don't know what you will get out of it, only that you will get it.

Re: Why Explore Space? A 1970 Letter to a Nun in Africa.

#129

Post by chris_wot »

jxcole wrote: post #9

I don't know if this makes me cruel, but whenever people talk about donating money to starving children in Africa, I always imagine the following: If I were to donate some amount of money to starving children in an impoverished nation every year I could, theoretically, bring some of them out of starvation. However, these children would then grow into adults, and then these adults would have children of their own. The…

To be blunt, I believe this is a cruel statement. What you are saying is that someone who is starving shouldn't be saved because they will grown into an adult who will have children.

You then suggest that looking at the causes of population explosions should be investigated and resolved, and therefore until this is fixed then children should starve.

A cruel sort of logic indeed.

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