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France bans short haul domestic flights in favour of train travel

euronews.com

121–130 of 149 posts

Re: France bans short haul domestic flights in favour of train travel

#121
post #16

I understand the criticism but to be fair high speed trains are better in many cases: Paris - Lyon by airplane: 1h15 plus travel to and from airport, plus security, boarding etc Paris - Lyon by train: 2h30, city center to city center, no security checks. This might actually be faster! Personally when traveling between London and Paris I choose the high speed train. It's usually more expensive but just the fact it rem…

Only when you can plan ahead by a few weeks. Typically, flying is still cheaper than the train. Tried to book a trip from London to home for boxing day. Eurostar was double

Re: France bans short haul domestic flights in favour of train travel

#122
post #115

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My man, you still haven't told me what this regulation is going to affect. What are the side effects? I'm not talking about energy infrastructure in Europe, nor am I interested in a wider discussion about 'eco-bullshit' or 'pseudo-environmental policies'. I'd just like to see your take on the unintended consequences of this policy that you are able to foresee. Furthermore, if the airplane traffic is indeed this negli…

I don't understand why you keep asking. I'm saying i expected unanticipated side effects to happen. Just like anytime you disrupt a well established market ( like public transport in france), with arbitrary decisions based solely on politic games.

If you're going to be dismissing well-meaning political actions with hand-waving and vague insinuations that it's ecobullshit, one would hope you could do better than just a shrug and a "beats me".

Re: France bans short haul domestic flights in favour of train travel

#123
post #16

I understand the criticism but to be fair high speed trains are better in many cases: Paris - Lyon by airplane: 1h15 plus travel to and from airport, plus security, boarding etc Paris - Lyon by train: 2h30, city center to city center, no security checks. This might actually be faster! Personally when traveling between London and Paris I choose the high speed train. It's usually more expensive but just the fact it rem…

If it’s better to travel by train, then no need to ban short flights, because people wouldn’t use them much. Empirically, since people ARE taking short flights instead of trains, the people who are doing so believe that flights are better for them. Why take away a choice from people?

People take those flights because it's usually much cheaper.

Re: France bans short haul domestic flights in favour of train travel

#124
post #114
post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> We've had numerous examples now of how pseudo-environmental policies destroyed economies and energy infrastructure in europe ... france leaving its nuclear infrastructure to rust I'm the first one to criticize pseudo-environmental policies, and Germany was indeed a mess due to pseudo-environmental policies. But the state of french nuclear infrastructure is not due to ecologists, it is very stupid to think it is, be…

it's a very famous fact that the fesseinhem nucleae power plant, for example, was an electoral deal between socialist party and the green one. But more importantly, the idea that the "renewable energies" had to be pushed forward aggressively, despite all data showing it couldn't replace nuclear or fossile, is a general gospel spread by green activists throughout the world. Political parties saw that the population we…

Fessenheim is the proof that the state of the other nuclear plants is not the result of the greens: Fessenheim only does not explain why the other nuclear plants are in disarray.

The situation for Fessenheim is in fact more complicated (the condition to close Fessenheim was to open Flamanville, proof that the government was pushing to maintain nuclear and was not at all anti-nuclear).

Well, you seem to not know the data. I'm a pro-nuclear, and yet, nowadays, nuclear is just too expensive (you cannot do a small project, you can only invest very huge amount for project that will take years) and is sometimes not the solution (increasing the nuclear share is really the exception in scientific studies, not because of "green brainwashing", just because nuclear is just way more complicated to put in place than solar and wind. Solar and wind have the problem of variability of production, but this problem is not as big as other pragmatical problem with nuclear). Not all the decisions that imply choosing something else than nuclear means it's "pseudo-environmental policies", sometimes, it's just the result of science. I also remember that in France, pseudo-science and incorrect data was used to pretend that solar was bad for nuclear. These data were bullshit at the time, but now are even less credible as the facts demonstrate it was not the case.

There are stupidity in the side of the greens, but trust me, brainwashing is as important from the pro-nuclear who just refuse every scientific facts that don't go their way. And there is pro-nuclear brainwashed people in France for a long time, as long as the brainwashed greens. It's very sad to see those people thinking they are smarter when they are just as stupid and bad for the environment.

Re: France bans short haul domestic flights in favour of train travel

#125
post #121
post #16

I understand the criticism but to be fair high speed trains are better in many cases: Paris - Lyon by airplane: 1h15 plus travel to and from airport, plus security, boarding etc Paris - Lyon by train: 2h30, city center to city center, no security checks. This might actually be faster! Personally when traveling between London and Paris I choose the high speed train. It's usually more expensive but just the fact it rem…

Only when you can plan ahead by a few weeks. Typically, flying is still cheaper than the train. Tried to book a trip from London to home for boxing day. Eurostar was double

I have found that flying is often cheaper for many close-ish and middle-ish distances where I want to go. Why is this? These are the cases where I would most like to take the train, and it is hard to justify by ticket price.

Re: France bans short haul domestic flights in favour of train travel

#126

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you don't think "the market" (aka people) should get to decide then you have probably have some authoritarian leanings. My argument is make the train service better so people want to use it instead of forcing them to do so.

If the market decides the planet/climate goes sideways. 'Better' doesn't make people want to use something if they can save money. The main reason airlines like EasyJet and RyanAir thrive is because they're cheaper, not better. Traveling by train vs. via one of those planes with minimal legroom and non-relciming seats? Always better for short haul. But the prices of trains (or rather: the subsidizing of air travel) m…

The solution to climate change is actually attacking the problem head on - not just making everyone poor and forcing them to use crappy government services and ultimately switching to communism.

Right now solving the problem means natural gas, nuclear and carbon capture.

Re: France bans short haul domestic flights in favour of train travel

#127

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Yes, the evil government is propping up BIG TRAIN because they hate planes!!! Dude, instead of mocking me and sounding like an ass, learn your history. 20 years ago in that country, it was impossible to go from Region to region by bus, you had to take the train. You couldn't do Le Mans Paris by bus because bus operators were not allowed to sell inter regional trips. It's the EU that forced France to allow these. Yo…

And it's the EU laws that are retranscribed here in France so what's your point exactly ?

It seems I made a mistake here, my bad.

Re: France bans short haul domestic flights in favour of train travel

#129
post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And taxing aviation fuel will make the rich pay trough the nose for their „privilege“. Which is good. What do you propose?

No. It's not good. It enables the rich to travel while locking out others. A fair system would ration access to a scarce resource based on need.

Perhaps there should be a hefty aviation fuel tax that works inversely: basically, the more you buy at once (per plane), the lower the tax is, by a very large amount.

So, if you're refueling an A380 super-jumbo or a 777, your fuel tax is very low, because those planes need a LOT of fuel. If you're refueling a 737, it'll be significantly higher, to penalize short routes. If you're refueling a small private jet, it'll be huge.

Basically, big jets that carry hundreds of passengers will get the lowest fuel tax this way, and airlines will be forced to prioritize moving people as efficiently as possible.

Re: France bans short haul domestic flights in favour of train travel

#130
post #79
post #64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What does France to Switzerland even mean? They border each other. You could walk.

I would think it obviously means between significant cities (ones with airports, at least, clearly) in each... Paris to Zurich or whatever.

Yea but the whatever part is what makes no sense. Sorry.

Paris-Zurich is very different from Lyon-Geneva

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