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Why I'm in the Army Reserve – an explainer for my friends in tech

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Re: Why I'm in the Army Reserve – an explainer for my friends in tech

#121

Post by Tepix »

advisedwang wrote: post #7

The author glosses over my biggest question "Who might you have to fight?" with a informative "Queen’s enemies." Might his squadron be called in to quash civil disturbance? Sent to the next Iraq? Is it reserved for defending the UK from invasion?

While reading, that paragraph really stood out to me. Why would you even want a queen? It's an expensive relic of darker times.

The whole idea of fighting for your life is completely alien to me. But then again i guess the people in Ukraine weren't expecting to be invaded for the longest time either.

Humans are animals.

Re: Why I'm in the Army Reserve – an explainer for my friends in tech

#122

Post by hugh-avherald »

rhn_mk1 wrote: post #39
ethbr0 wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

+1. Part of being part of a national military is subordinating your desires to the chain of command, which in a democracy usually flows to the highest elected official. If one wants to pick and choose "right" conflicts, one shouldn't serve. And ultimately... while I know HN has a pretty anti-authority bend... if you don't trust your government to deploy military power, what do you trust them for? Which isn't saying t…

Being subordinate didn't work for the Nuremberg "I was following orders" crowd, which makes me doubt your assertion. > if you don't trust your government to deploy military power, what do you trust them for? Do you have to trust them for anything? It's not like it's a viable option to decide that you don't want to designate any government as "yours". Good luck surviving in no man's land if you do. What makes governme…

It's often misunderstood, but the Nuremberg Defence is a genuine defence to criminal behaviour, including war crimes. It's just not an absolute one, and cannot be used for the crime of genocide. If you're in a missile silo and you're ordered to nuke Moscow, you're not responsible for the outcome.

Re: Why I'm in the Army Reserve – an explainer for my friends in tech

#123

Post by hunterb123 »

bobkazamakis wrote: post #105
hunterb123 wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In a sense federal jobs is socialistic I suppose, which is why you should want limited government. But you do need a military force in the country, and you should give people benefits for their sacrifice. It's not genuine to say military service is a welfare program, it's more of a jobs program.

> In a sense federal jobs is socialistic I suppose, which is why you should want limited government. Before one spends a trillion that could be going to the welfare of the citizens themselves, yeah probably. >But you do need a military force in the country Obviously, not sure why this is said here. >It's not genuine to say military service is a welfare program, it's more of a jobs program. It's not genuine to say it'…

> Before one spends a trillion that could be going to the welfare of the citizens themselves, yeah probably.

So your suggested system would be to do away with the jobs and just give the taxpayer money away? That's much more socialist. You need to incentivize people or they won't work. If you do away with the military, you might as well not tax the people as much in the first place rather than taking their money and distributing it in a welfare program.

> Obviously, not sure why this is said here.

It was said because it wasn't clear what you were suggesting. If you're for keeping the military I'm all for lowering the industrial war complex, but I thought we were talking about military service and the benefits we give soldiers. Salaries make up a big part of military expense but those are jobs filled and livelihoods supported. It's the rockets and money we funnel into the middle east that could be cut, not GI bills.

> It's not genuine to say it's a jobs program either - my healthcare money is being strapped to rockets and shipped across the ocean. Are those rockets filing taxes?

That's fine, along as we agree that it's not genuine to say it's a welfare program. While I don't agree with a lot (or most) of our overseas ventures, especially Middle East or LATAM, you do need a force to protect freedoms. So I agree overall in the branches, just not the leadership, unless they are reducing our presence in places where they aren't needed.

Re: Why I'm in the Army Reserve – an explainer for my friends in tech

#124

Post by ethbr0 »

dogman144 wrote: post #85
micromacrofoot wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How can you call something a positive and then immediately call it a tragedy? that's not a positive at all!

I will never view military service as a bad thing in totality. Locally evaluated, it's a good option. Putting aside the more heady concepts of public service and sacrifice, it is one of the last remaining conduits to change your stars and "make a man/woman/adult out of you," *although it is certainly not without faults and has certainly caused horrible experiences for people who served*. It is an imperfect organizati…

As the son of a son of a father who wouldn't have gone to college without WWII-era tuition assistance, can confirm it changes entire family trajectories.

My grandfather had the work ethic and intelligence in him, subsequently proven, but was born dirt poor with a snowball's chance in hell he could have afforded college without the GI Bill.

The military is an option which largely accepts you if you say "Yes" and can pass a basic intelligence test. Those are the only requirements. Not your family name. Not your family wealth. Not (now) your race or gender or sexual orientation.

And in trade for that, they open up benefits that change lives.

It certainly shouldn't be the only option, but that it is an option is better than not existing.

Re: Why I'm in the Army Reserve – an explainer for my friends in tech

#125

Post by yywwbbn »

mschuster91 wrote: post #23
jmyeet wrote: post #14

So one of the things I like about Tiktok is you get exposed to something you normally wouldn't and it can be fascinating. One example of this I had an Air Force recruiter pop up on my fyp. This is obviously US-centric (as opposed to the article, which is the UK) but here are some things I've learned: 1. The difference between Reserve and Guard? Reserve is Federal, Guard is State (this was news to me); 2. Signing up f…

> As ridiculous as the US college system is in terms of cost, I'm happy things like this exist to at least give people more options. The only people I want in an army are those who have freely and independently chosen to join the army and who have been psychologically and physically checked to be fit for service. The motivation of a soldier should exclusively be to serve their country, not financial or status (e.g. c…

‘ The motivation of a soldier should exclusively be to serve their country, not financial or status (e.g. citizenship) gain.’

No successful professional military has ever worked like this. Basically you want a an army comprised mainly of fanatical nationalists whose only purpose is to ‘serve their country’ (whatever that means). Hate it to break it to you but such a force would more closely resemble the Waffen SS, rather than the citizen militias of colonial America or ancient Greece. A modern professional military should mainly made up from balanced and educated professionals to be effective. People like this usually have other choices in life and thus need certain incentives to join. Not saying serving you country shouldn’t be a part of it, but for most such people that alone is not enough.

For that you either need to decrease the general size of the army dramatically or find other ways of ‘motivating’ new recruits to ‘join’. The second options has not historically resulted in anything resembling ‘ excellence’ outside of ultra-militaristic, jingoist societies.

Re: Why I'm in the Army Reserve – an explainer for my friends in tech

#126

Post by jleyank »

hunterb123 wrote: post #61
namelessoracle wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Many other social welfare programs require you to do X or Y to keep receiving benefits as well. From a societal level its absolutely used as a social welfare program to create opportunities for lower class individuals to advance. Thats even used as a part of their recruitment pitch! If you can handle the military service its well known that its a very easy way to make 6 figure salary is to join the military get a hig…

Most social welfare programs have limitations as requirements, which has a negative effect. It keeps people content with the welfare because if they work they no longer qualify for it. A lot of the time the welfare will pay similar to a job so they won't bother with the slight increase. The military you put your 4 years in, you get your experience, and you earn your GI bill for further education (or you go into priva…

Officers = jobs, enlisted = welfare if you want a naive partitioning. Although high-ranking NCO's probably do quite well as they actually do/direct the work. Officers just look good :-).

Re: Why I'm in the Army Reserve – an explainer for my friends in tech

#127

Post by adewinter »

qiskit wrote: post #110
advisedwang wrote: post #7

The author glosses over my biggest question "Who might you have to fight?" with a informative "Queen’s enemies." Might his squadron be called in to quash civil disturbance? Sent to the next Iraq? Is it reserved for defending the UK from invasion?

> "Queen’s enemies." I can't believe people still fight for royalty. Ants fight their queen's enemies. Free human being should fight for themselves, their families, etc.

Sure if you take the most hardcore literal interpretation. It's just short hand for "the enemies of the state" or "whoever my duly elected leadership consider to be the bad guys". Yes, people still willingly give up their independence for what they consider to be the greater good. Consider the entire united states armes forces and almost all government employees (in particular the folks who work for 3 letter agencies).

Re: Why I'm in the Army Reserve – an explainer for my friends in tech

#128

Post by HL33tibCe7 »

ZanyProgrammer wrote: post #109
HL33tibCe7 wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I guess he like's his big time Major pay I doubt pay is a factor for the author at all. A quick look ( https://apply.army.mod.uk/what-we-offer/army-reserve/army-re... ) reveals Majors in the reserves make £135/day, which is frankly nothing compared to what the author would earn in his job at Shopify.

Well presumably he gets paid at the normal active duty rate when he’s called up, or whatever the UK equivalent is.

http://www.armedforces.co.uk/armypayscales.php#.YksfMKTTXDs the salary for an actively-serving Major ranges from roughly £55k-£65k pa. The author is probably earning at least twice that at Shopify, if not considerably more.

Re: Why I'm in the Army Reserve – an explainer for my friends in tech

#129

Post by barbazoo »

toomuchtodo wrote: post #25
jmyeet wrote: post #14

So one of the things I like about Tiktok is you get exposed to something you normally wouldn't and it can be fascinating. One example of this I had an Air Force recruiter pop up on my fyp. This is obviously US-centric (as opposed to the article, which is the UK) but here are some things I've learned: 1. The difference between Reserve and Guard? Reserve is Federal, Guard is State (this was news to me); 2. Signing up f…

This isn't a positive. It is a tragedy that these services (education, healthcare) are difficult to obtain without military service in a supposedly developed country.

It's nuts that some people have to consider joining the military to be able to pay for tuition and/or to get health care. I have nothing to contribute other than expressing how soul crushing this seems for someone outside the US.

Re: Why I'm in the Army Reserve – an explainer for my friends in tech

#130

Post by basisword »

AllegedAlec wrote: post #101
basisword wrote: post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't see what 'tech person' has to do with it. Personal opinions on the military are pretty basic ethical decisions.

Because you start out from the standard tech person position of arrogance. You didn't try to argue why you think his decision was ethically wrong. You went for a smug soundbite that sounds glib and clever.

1. He chose to join in 2007 - during the Afghanistan and Iraq wars. Those are both wars that, in my opinion and the opinion of many others (evident by the massive protests at the time) the British should not have been involved in.

2. In my opinion, anybody that joins the army when they aren't defending against an invasion (i.e. someone who travels thousands of miles to fight another country nowhere near their own) has a screw loose. There are times when fighting is necessary (e.g. WW2, Ukraine/Russia). There have been few of those times recently.

3. I have friends who have friends + relatives in the military. I've met those people at social events. I can't obviously say they represent all people in the military but the ones I've met have all been racist, homophobic and worse. Again, I believe you have to have a certain mentality to join the military when your country isn't actually at risk and this has been bore out by the people I've met.

4. The British military has committed countless crimes and atrocities over the last 50 years. I can't respect anyone who would decide to be part of that institution when it is not necessary to be.

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