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Venting doesn’t work

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Re: Venting doesn’t work

#121

Post by mettamage »

swagasaurus-rex wrote: post #8

Stop using small sample sized studies done on college campuses (n = 600, 178, 60) to push clickbait headline articles. Sounds like saying, "Don't cry when you're sad it Doesn't Work" How about let people do what they want? People vent because they want to know they aren't crazy or at fault. Not because they're trying to be calm or forget grievances.

Quite frankly, almost all psychological experiments are nonsense. After the replication crisis and other things (e.g. p-hacking) I simply can't be bothered to take the field seriously. I am beyond mad at the intellectual dishonesty many sciences have committed, social psychology in particular. I couldn't care less if it's an emergent failing of science. First principles were not followed, too few people cared, I can't ever trust the fields again that took part in this.

I'll stick to forms of science that actually know something worthwhile. And when I need to intuit anything about human behavior, then I know that I am on my own.

With that said, here's my criteria for a study I'm willing to take seriously:

* n = 10000

* The effect size is big

* It's measured in at least on western, one eastern and one other culture

* It's independently reproduced by at least 2 other independent universities/research institutes

There are probably another few things, but I think you get the spirit.

Re: Venting doesn’t work

#122

Post by J5892 »

dudul wrote: post #64
blhack wrote: post #41

One of the most stressful projects I ever worked on had a really great way of dealing with the stress (a policy that I created). Every meeting, at the beginning of the meeting, everybody was required to complain for 5 minutes. Just talk about all the stupid decisions that got us to this point, how unreasonable the timeline was, any staffing issues you were having, any parts you needed, etc. 5 minutes. You are require…

How did you make sure that no one would complain that "Bob was an idiot who kept breaking the build", or "Alice never does her code reviews and blocks everyone"?

Best approach: Don't hire people like that.

Good approach: Specify that complaints be non-specific to a person on the team.

Re: Venting doesn’t work

#123

Post by peteradio »

JAlexoid wrote: post #53
peteradio wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

When I bang my thumb with a hammer I yell FUUUUUCCCCKKKKKK as loud as I can, are you telling me that doesn't make the pain less? I'm almost 100% certain that form of catharsis works. It even works in reverse for me, if I'm having a moment of intense emotional strain, punching the wall (also yelling fuck as loud as possible) resets my brain. To say catharsis doesn't work seems to be a limitation of the definition of c…

That's mischaracterization of catharsis. As for releasing intense emotional strain - you're more likely to lash out. Have you tried not punching the wall and have a time out instead? Because people who "punch the wall" are, according to multiple studies, more likely to lash out and be abusive.

> That's mischaracterization of catharsis.

Please explain? Pain is both processed physically and psychologically in my experience. Is the suggestion that if I feel pain psychologically I'm abnormal? Catharsis is a name given to a human action as old as time.

> Because people who "punch the wall" are, according to multiple studies, more likely to lash out and be abusive.

I would be curious to see the studies, perhaps people who lash out are more likely to have issues worth punching a wall over? All sorts of biases could come into play.

> Have you tried not punching the wall and have a time out instead?

The times I've punched a wall are too few to derive meaningful statistics vs other methods of unwinding.

Re: Venting doesn’t work

#125

Post by krinchan »

PragmaticPulp wrote: post #109

From my purely anecdotal experience with mentoring younger people, I've seen two main categories of venting: 1) Venting about frustrations by talking them through with someone who will listen. This forces people to put their frustrations into words and elucidate the narrative as they put it into words. This can not only help people identify their feelings and work through them, but it also forces people to decide wha…

So is 1 basically rubber ducky debugging but for social situations? Because I do this pretty often by myself. I feel it does require a certain level of self-honesty and I've often used good friends (the ones who I know will call me on my BS) as sounding boards to double check my conclusions.

Re: Venting doesn’t work

#126

Post by mikepurvis »

peteradio wrote: post #107
mikepurvis wrote: post #72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Because people who "punch the wall" are, according to multiple studies, more likely to lash out and be abusive. Presumably the wall-punching and tendency toward other physical/emotional abuses are tied to one or more underlying common causes. That is, people shouldn't be told to punch a wall (for cartharsis) or even necessarily not to do so (because it'll make you abusive), but those for whom that is a temptation o…

I guess that's my point, how do you disentangle the need for cathartic outburst from the negative connotations and actual perhaps small positive impact of the cathartic outburst? Is practicing karate and punching boards on a schedule ok?

I feel like it's different when it's a scheduled, planned release, rather than losing control in the moment.

Like, my overall emotional regulation is way better on the weeks when I've been more active, with cycling, lane swimming, taking walks, etc. And I'm certainly not doing those things "in anger", but it's still absolutely a kind of release.

Of course, the article is mostly talking about venting as a scheduled, planned thing too, so I don't know.

Re: Venting doesn’t work

#127

Post by JAlexoid »

antisthenes wrote: post #83
JAlexoid wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I can link you to another bunch. Because I took interest on the subject. I've been told to "vent" almost all of my life and only a few years ago I got exposed to this research. I'm citing one of the earlier ones and there's plenty of newer studies. My "allegations" are based in research and not empty words(unlike the accusations in your comment)

Please do. There's a possibility that I'm using the term catharsis completely wrong, so I'm not taking the study at face value. I've never heard of people equating venting with catharsis or linking them logically. To me, catharsis is something that occurs rarely, to some people, after a tragedy. It's sort of an emotional closure that lets you move on in peace.

In psychology venting is called catharsis.

As for articles: Let's start with the one in the article.

https://psycnet.apa.org/record/2002-13494-002

https://psycnet.apa.org/record/1966-04874-001

https://psycnet.apa.org/record/2002-00162-010

https://www.tandfonline.com/doi/abs/10.1080/10463283.2012.69...

https://study.com/academy/lesson/catharsis-in-psychology-the...

Re: Venting doesn’t work

#128

Post by Enginerrrd »

PragmaticPulp wrote: post #109

From my purely anecdotal experience with mentoring younger people, I've seen two main categories of venting: 1) Venting about frustrations by talking them through with someone who will listen. This forces people to put their frustrations into words and elucidate the narrative as they put it into words. This can not only help people identify their feelings and work through them, but it also forces people to decide wha…

Yeah, I know it's anecdotal... but when I've had issues with people that "stuck", and didn't go away on their own, I've had a lot of success writing those people a letter. It forces me to present all the information factually, how I feel about it, why I feel that way, etc. which helps elucidate the charitable and less-charitable interpretations of what happened. In writing, I have to reread and edit what I wrote a dozen times at least to make it nice and coherent. I also have a rule, that I can't send out such letters until the next day after writing the letter. Every time I've done that, I didn't need to send the letter after I wrote it. The anger was gone. Sometimes it persisted for weeks leading up to me writing the letter.

I would absolutely describe that as "venting". I just wouldn't describe it as super aggressive or hostile, even though sometimes I think the letters were pretty harsh.

Re: Venting doesn’t work

#130

Post by peteradio »

mikepurvis wrote: post #126
peteradio wrote: post #107

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I guess that's my point, how do you disentangle the need for cathartic outburst from the negative connotations and actual perhaps small positive impact of the cathartic outburst? Is practicing karate and punching boards on a schedule ok?

I feel like it's different when it's a scheduled, planned release, rather than losing control in the moment. Like, my overall emotional regulation is way better on the weeks when I've been more active, with cycling, lane swimming, taking walks, etc. And I'm certainly not doing those things "in anger", but it's still absolutely a kind of release. Of course, the article is mostly talking about venting as a scheduled, p…

Have you had what you would consider an extreme event which didn't ripple beyond a need to maintain regular exercise? One time I was upset because my now wife decided to spend time with friends instead of with me on the last day before I drove off to grad school across the country. I rode my bike around a large lake (not something I would normally do). Is that somehow doing it wrong? It seems like the whole issue is "don't rock the boat or people will look at you sideways and make you an outcast". Works fine to be and express yourself in a safe place (accepting people/sound-proof walls), even if its peakish at times, just my experience.
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