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Use Jonathan's card to buy yourself an iPad

sam.odio.com

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Re: Use Jonathan's card to buy yourself an iPad

#121

Post by [deleted] »

Sam_Odio wrote: post #32
sequoia wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah I think that's great. Honestly I think it's awesome how he's redirecting this money from Starbucks to a worthwhile cause. BUT he can do that without the holier-than-thou attitude; the latter is not a requirement for the former. :) Basically I've heard that line before ("how can you X when Y is going on in the world??") and it's basically just a way to feel morally superior and boost your ego, it doesn't actually…

That's a valid point. But is pursuing art (or whatsver) admitting to yourself that you value art more than world hunger? After all, that's how you're allocating your resources. Fwiw, anyone who knows me know I don't have a holier-than-thou attitude (though I took one for this post). This was mostly meant as an edgy/controversial twist to the social experiment: how do peoople react when someone takes the money (which…

[deleted]

Re: Use Jonathan's card to buy yourself an iPad

#122

Post by true_religion »

woof wrote: post #55
carbonica wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Close - they bought one gift card, and then used Starbucks' website to transfer the money from Jonathan's card to their own.

And how did he get the Card Security Code (PIN)?

They either guessed or brute forced it. Both of which are essentially illegal computer hacking.

I don't know about you, but I'm not going to do business with someone (here the Founder of Freshplum) if they enjoy hacking credit accounts in their free time.

His reason for doing so is so poor that I worry about his ethics in other affairs.

Re: Use Jonathan's card to buy yourself an iPad

#124

Post by true_religion »

niels_olson wrote: post #103

To all who want to slam on Sam Odio's moral code: You're seriously arguing that a hack that converts money into fat, caffeinated Americans and corporate profit is better than a hack that hacks that hack to feed the poor? We should be finding more ways to prevent the conversion of money into American fat. In fact: as a doctor, there's my challenge to you: please find ways to catch calories before they land in middle-c…

The agreement was that you're allowed to use the gift card at starbucks.

The agreement wasn't that you can hack the pin of the giftcard, then transfer over all of the money to your own account.

That's essentially stealing from the 'coffee and sandwiches' charity for your own personal reasons.

Its a violation of the trust given to him by the community, and rightly puts a sour taste into many peoples mouths.

Re: Use Jonathan's card to buy yourself an iPad

#125

Post by lazerwalker »

LesZedCB wrote: post #107
sequoia wrote: post #7

"Or am I alone in thinking that helping a stranger find their next caffeine fix is not what we should be worried about in today's world?" sigh This is such a silly, stupid point to make: Buying an iPad? What about world hunger!? Going to the movies? What about the modern slave trade!? Painting a picture? Women in Sudanese refugee camps can't go to the bathroom at night without fear of rape, and here you painting a pi…

My thought is, what if instead of a starbucks card, Jonathan gave out a card for a little family owned coffee shop somewhere accessible? Then it's helping specific people make a living rather than 'the man' making more money. Maybe starbucks is good, maybe bad. But his objection was yuppies buying yuppies coffee, not against starbucks itself, or the coffee industry. I'm definitely not a yuppie, I like starbucks coffe…

What makes the experiment so interesting is the anonymity factor. Since there are a functionally-unlimited number of Starbucks locations, you have absolutely no way of knowing who else is using the card and on what.

If it was for a small locally-owned coffee shop, it's a given that the folks charging/refilling the card are the same people frequenting the shop with you every day. I can't imagine this wouldn't drastically affect the way the experiment turned out; the social obligation is much stronger when you can connect anonymous people to faces or names, even if you don't know exactly who is participating.

Re: Use Jonathan's card to buy yourself an iPad

#126

Post by ay »

keidian wrote: post #118
ay wrote: post #72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Now the community should do a social experiment of encouraging Sam to return the same amount of money onto the card as he stole and see if it works.

Or a social experiment of avoiding his new YC startup Freshplum http://allthingsd.com/20110621/sam-odio-i-left-facebook-to-r...

That'd be way disproportional. And there could be a totally unrelated people who might suffer from the result of that experiment. Just get the money back on the card.

As a side effect he can claim the karma points for the entire good deed he described, on his own account. Then his experiment would get a much nicer feel.

Re: Use Jonathan's card to buy yourself an iPad

#128

Post by AlfaWolph »

Triumvark wrote: post #34
sequoia wrote: post #7

"Or am I alone in thinking that helping a stranger find their next caffeine fix is not what we should be worried about in today's world?" sigh This is such a silly, stupid point to make: Buying an iPad? What about world hunger!? Going to the movies? What about the modern slave trade!? Painting a picture? Women in Sudanese refugee camps can't go to the bathroom at night without fear of rape, and here you painting a pi…

Eh, I found Jonathan's "Buying yuppies coffee will improve the world!" naivete far more offensive. I didn't see OP as criticizing frivolity, I saw him more criticizing Jonathan's suggestion that this game was meaningfully altruistic. Eye of the beholder I guess.

The whole "Buying yuppies coffee will improve the world!" was obviously tongue in cheek. It's hard to believe some people don't see that.

Re: Use Jonathan's card to buy yourself an iPad

#129

Post by [deleted] »

MatthewPhillips wrote: post #48
Udo wrote: post #20

So essentially you're proud of stealing huge amounts of money from a fund set up by people for a specific purpose, and then you channel this money to suit your own needs while claiming moral superiority ? You know, even if the money you stole for "the little children OMG think of the children" really reaches the intended recipients, which it probably won't if this is a typical 3rd world development fund, you still be…

Jonathan said it was a social experiment. This, and people's reaction to it, is part of that.

[deleted]

Re: Use Jonathan's card to buy yourself an iPad

#130

Post by nordsieck »

blhack wrote: post #84
sequoia wrote: post #7

"Or am I alone in thinking that helping a stranger find their next caffeine fix is not what we should be worried about in today's world?" sigh This is such a silly, stupid point to make: Buying an iPad? What about world hunger!? Going to the movies? What about the modern slave trade!? Painting a picture? Women in Sudanese refugee camps can't go to the bathroom at night without fear of rape, and here you painting a pi…

Read this: http://www.utilitarian.net/singer/by/199704--.htm It's about utilitarianism, I think you'll like it, it's making the same point you are. (It's called "The Shallow Pond and The Drowing Child - By Peter Singer") edit: (If you read the paper, it's discussing exactly what parent was describing, and is completely relevant to the discussion)

Seems pretty silly. A child, when rescued from a university pond, returns to a safe stable situation.
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